Newbie Multiple Questions - Quadcopter Build

[piersuk]

OK, having lurked for a little while it seems time to get posting.

Looking at a quadcopter for the following reasons:

1. To get started in the hobby
2. To connect a GoPro 3+ and take some aerial footage
3. In time use FPV equipment

Considerations:

1. Have a limited budget and don't want to go mad
2. Don't want to have expensive replacement parts costs
3. Don't want to put the GoPro to any unnecessary risk
4. Don't want to have to upgrade after a month of practice because it got boring
5. More than 10 mins flight time
6. Don't want a toy

Condsidering the options I have looked at the following:

1. DJI F450 built from a kit supplied complete (eventually fitting a GPS to the Naza Lite)
2. DJI Phantom (Again fitting a GPS module later)
3. TBS Discovery Clone Frame with DJI Motors (eventually fitting a GPS to the Naza Lite)

So given all the above what should I look at. Is it better to go for an out of the box solution like the Phantom or build the DJI/TBS and learn, is there any benefit in this?

Any opinions or advice are welcome and appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Motopreserve]

I truly believe that building it yourself will give you a leg up in the future for when/if you look to expand on your interest in the hobby. While you can buy an RTF option, you miss out on developing knowledge, as well as typically paying more for what features you get.

Plan on crashing while you get up to speed. So cheap replacement parts are a good call. Also realize that you are putting the gopro at risk by sending it airborne, so perhaps make sure your rig's payload can handle the camera in its protective case.

Also, realize that many setups may provide less than 10 minutes flight time - but those numbers can be massaged in the future with various motors, props and batteries.

Its a hell of an obsession once you get going....

have fun!

 

[piersuk]

Great thanks for that.

I would be interested to know the thoughts on purchase to learn and then sell to buy something better OR accept that it will crash whatever and just replace parts on something that will stay with me for a while.

Thanks again!

 

[jbrumberg]

piersuk- Welcome. Sometimes we need to look at our needs and our wants. You need to learn to fly a quad otherwise under Considerations: #1- After a couple of crashes and you'll have them trust me; your repair and replacement costs will challenge your mental status. #2 Without flying experience you will have repair and replacement expenses and will put (#3 concern) your GoPro at risk #4 Learning to fly takes a lot of practice which is boring. Learning to fly well takes even more practice as I am learning. If you enjoy flying a quad you will always be challenging yourself to improve regardless of what you are flying. #5 More than 10 minutes flight time is not that easy to achieve, especially when one starts carrying around additional payload. It takes a lot of trade offs with motors, ESC's, props, frame, and battery choices. One can achieve +10 minute flight times even with a "toy" grade quad.

The amount of technology in those "toy" grade quads is pretty impressive, and paired with a decent programmable Tx their performance and range improves significantly. They make great trainers and are a lot easier and cheaper to repair and replace during the learning curve.

I am not ashamed to admit this, I am a newbee builder, I have successfully built, flown, and basically tuned my build to the point I felt comfortable enough to fly my quad build around, and to the point that I crashed it hard enough to require some major frame replacement parts that I am currently awaiting. I pushed my limits, and found them. This is part of my learning curve and I have been flying quads for about a year and I practice flying all the time. I do not mean to sound mean or hard here; just a reality check. You will crash. Your decision is how much do you want to spend on each crash.

Good luck

 

[Motopreserve]

It seems to me that there is a value for a trainer quad - as well as looking at your first build as something that you can change, improve, start over with and still love it - even when you move on to something else simultaneously.

A well built (and fun) quad should always have a place in your stable of crafts.


Spelling issues...blame Siri!

 

[piersuk]

The amount of technology in those "toy" grade quads is pretty impressive, and paired with a decent programmable Tx their performance and range improves significantly. They make great trainers and are a lot easier and cheaper to repair and replace during the learning curve.

Thanks - That to me seems the problem with some of the quads, the controller is part of the deal.
I think what you're saying is build??

It seems to me that there is a value for a trainer quad - as well as looking at your first build as something that you can change, improve, start over with and still love it - even when you move on to something else simultaneously.

A well built (and fun) quad should always have a place in your stable of crafts.

Again, are you coming on the side of build? - Speeling mistakes accepted

 

[jbrumberg]

"A well built (and fun) quad should always have a place in your stable of crafts."

There needs to be a fun factor in this. I take a lot more risks flying my $30 quads and fly them in conditions that I would not consider appropriate for my quad build. I can charge 6 1S 600mAh batteries at once with my charger; each battery can give me ~11 minutes of flight time in "warmer" temperatures. I can fly my hanger (3 +1) of little guys for literally over an hour with only battery changes for interruptions provided that everything goes according "to plan" with launchings, flights, and landings. It has happened..... like once :strawberry:. I would love to be able to repeat this experience. I could not do this with my build; I do not have the resources even if I could fly it without crashing it.

Piersuk, I am just trying to give you another way to look at this quad thing. The important thing for you is to get a build going and get a quad, any quad in the air., and start flying and practicing, and building. Building a quad has helped me understand more about this whole RC hobby than just flying my "toy" grades around. And yes part of the problem, a major part IMO, is generally with those "toy" grades the problem is not with the quad's FC it's with the crappy Tx that comes with the quad. The quads are detuned by the stock Tx. A decent programmable multichannel Tx definitely will improve the range and performance of any quad with which it will bind. An additional benefit is these Tx's are not exactly the easiest pieces of equipment to figure out either so as one learns to fly and orientation with the toys they are also learning Tx stick control and how to set up and program the Tx.

 

[Motopreserve]

I was definitely coming in on the side of building. But in the meantime, practicing on a "toy" quad really helps when you finally launch the bigger quad for the first time.

If nothing else, it builds confidence in your first flight, even with the crappy Tx.

 

[jbrumberg]

Actually the stock Tx's are the best way to learn initially because they are detuned, and they usually have a "low" (beginner) and "high" (advanced) setting as a stepping stone. I think this is where the boredom factor could happen.

 

[piersuk]

Thanks - With all that in mind is there a "trainer" quad option or is a clone 450/Phantom/TBS (Clone) classed as training?

 

[jbrumberg]

Thanks - With all that in mind is there a "trainer" quad option or is a clone 450/Phantom/TBS (Clone) classed as training?

That depends on what your goals are and how much you are willing to spend on what could be a total, complete monetary loss. I go/went cheap- ~$30. I just like to fly. I probably will go simple FPV or GoPro at some point. I need to fly more and crash less before I start adding on more stuff to my build. I get exactly for which I pay; it is basic at all levels. I want to fly my quads more than I want them to fly for me as I program. Your expressed beginning starting needs/goals seem to be leading you to a higher level of programmability- GPS, altitude hold, etc. with which to start. The Phantoms and their clones have a large following and most owner/operators apparently like them if they are programmed correctly, and there are a couple of even less costly alternatives that offer most if not all the same features.

The bottom line is: You will fly. You will crash. You will have to repair. You will have to replace. It is the law of gravity and the history of flight.

 

[Motopreserve]

Just to clarify my opinion:

There are 2 types of "trainers." The first would be a mini-quad which would cost between $30-$90. That would basic - but force you to learn the fundamentals of quad flight.

The 2nd would be your "big build," but built with the cheapest, decent gear available. This would be so when you crash - and you are VERY likely to crash - you won't have lost $1000.

If you go this 2nd route (or even better, both!), you develop the skills to build the next quad, which you will absolutely want to do, regardless of whether you buy the cheaper built one, or the more expensive RTF version.

IMHO, The RTF option is good for those that A) have a lot of money or B) don't ever want to tinker and can afford to pay for exactly what they want. That would be anywhere between a Phantom and a $3000+ Hexa/Octo. Both those options being more than you'd spend to build a cheap 400-550mm quad with cheap components that will hoist you into the air and get you on your way.