N00b - RCT800 GoPro AP Build

[Motopreserve]

I really don't want to get off track any more than we have already. But this is just weird with all the engineers around here.

You like Neve? Take a look at THIS. It's the studio I learned at - and it was truly a one of a kind Neve. I worked on a lot of boards - nothing even came close to this.

JP, you get your Cadillac yet?

 

[Jpdeuce]

I'm looking for more or less the same solution as JP and would potentially be interested in picking up one of your quads Sleepy if you have another on offer. That said, I'm looking for 20 minutes in the air (or better), can you accommodate?

Actually, unwittingly you've brought the thread full circle. What you are looking for is something more similar to what's in my original build, and probably not similar to Sleepy's. Since that's the track I started down, it's all I've been searching for and reading about for about 3 weeks. By interweb standards, that makes me somewhat of an expert, so give what I'm about to say the weight it's due. :livid:

For longer flight times, you are looking for a magical blend of:
Lower AUW (All Up Weight) + slow spinning efficient motors (low kv) + biga$$ props + high voltage (6S)

I urge you to search the googles for "RCgroups 129 min flight" and take a look at that thread. The dood is using 4S but he's got FOUR packs of 4S, not 1. He also has the most minimal frame you can put together. He also can I expect do little more than hover (as slow spinning motors with big props will not be all that agile in the air). Hence searching for the nice blend of that equation.

If you're carrying a camera, gimbal, FC+GPS, landing gear, FPV gear?, and a decent sized battery, you're easily in the 2kg+ range. And if you want to actually be able to have some mixed flying instead of just hovering on a quad, you're probably not looking for a rig with 17-18" props. If you look at my build in the first post, and use that as a guide, you might get near what you are looking for. But, as the advice I got will tell you and what got me to here, it will be more of a beast than you need for a GoPro. You might think about the 5010 motors that are either 530 or 620 as a base and see what you can build from there. There isn't a lot of selection for 6S stuff that was in my price range, so that may be a challenge for you.

OK, now back to the sound engineer thread I started... :highly_amused:

 

[Jpdeuce]

JP, you get your Cadillac yet?

His people are still in discussions with my people. Stand by.

 

[Level Flight]

Actually, unwittingly you've brought the thread full circle. What you are looking for is something more similar to what's in my original build, and probably not similar to Sleepy's. Since that's the track I started down, it's all I've been searching for and reading about for about 3 weeks. By interweb standards, that makes me somewhat of an expert, so give what I'm about to say the weight it's due. :livid:

For longer flight times, you are looking for a magical blend of:
Lower AUW (All Up Weight) + slow spinning efficient motors (low kv) + biga$$ props + high voltage (6S)

I urge you to search the googles for "RCgroups 129 min flight" and take a look at that thread. The dood is using 4S but he's got FOUR packs of 4S, not 1. He also has the most minimal frame you can put together. He also can I expect do little more than hover (as slow spinning motors with big props will not be all that agile in the air). Hence searching for the nice blend of that equation.

If you're carrying a camera, gimbal, FC+GPS, landing gear, FPV gear?, and a decent sized battery, you're easily in the 2kg+ range. And if you want to actually be able to have some mixed flying instead of just hovering on a quad, you're probably not looking for a rig with 17-18" props. If you look at my build in the first post, and use that as a guide, you might get near what you are looking for. But, as the advice I got will tell you and what got me to here, it will be more of a beast than you need for a GoPro. You might think about the 5010 motors that are either 530 or 620 as a base and see what you can build from there. There isn't a lot of selection for 6S stuff that was in my price range, so that may be a challenge for you.

OK, now back to the sound engineer thread I started... :highly_amused:

Thank you for sharing your experience and suggestions. I did follow a few threads on long flight times but it just seemed to me they were taking me too far from my objective which is a combination of payload and duration in a quad configuration.

Actually, unwittingly you've brought the thread full circle. What you are looking for is something more similar to what's in my original build, and probably not similar to Sleepy's. Since that's the track I started down, it's all I've been searching for and reading about for about 3 weeks. By interweb standards, that makes me somewhat of an expert, so give what I'm about to say the weight it's due. :livid:

For longer flight times, you are looking for a magical blend of:
Lower AUW (All Up Weight) + slow spinning efficient motors (low kv) + biga$$ props + high voltage (6S)

I urge you to search the googles for "RCgroups 129 min flight" and take a look at that thread. The dood is using 4S but he's got FOUR packs of 4S, not 1. He also has the most minimal frame you can put together. He also can I expect do little more than hover (as slow spinning motors with big props will not be all that agile in the air). Hence searching for the nice blend of that equation.

If you're carrying a camera, gimbal, FC+GPS, landing gear, FPV gear?, and a decent sized battery, you're easily in the 2kg+ range. And if you want to actually be able to have some mixed flying instead of just hovering on a quad, you're probably not looking for a rig with 17-18" props. If you look at my build in the first post, and use that as a guide, you might get near what you are looking for. But, as the advice I got will tell you and what got me to here, it will be more of a beast than you need for a GoPro. You might think about the 5010 motors that are either 530 or 620 as a base and see what you can build from there. There isn't a lot of selection for 6S stuff that was in my price range, so that may be a challenge for you.

OK, now back to the sound engineer thread I started... :highly_amused:

I established this objective (flight time & payload) after reading the specs on the Matrix: 20-25 minutes with a 6S 8000Mah power system flying a GoPro on a two axis gimbal. It folds for ease of storage and is a solid machine in windy conditions........based on the various owner comments and observing a number of videos. It isn't upgradable to carry more than the BM Pocket Cinema which is why I began looking at hexacopters, ostensibly for the same reasons you indicated in your first post.
As a DIY project this setup can easily bump into the $3K ceiling so some budgets may become a little stretched. I'm ok with it and have lots of components from other projects to keep costs in line.

All said and done, and with Sleepy and Moto's input, it appears evident a multi-rotor pilot will end up over time with half a dozen machines, not much different from my accumulated pod & boom collection. I'm feeling more confident with the strategy of buying what I need right now and letting future need take care of itself.

 

[Motopreserve]

Seems like you are both on the right path. The only thing I would mention is that although the frame can contribute to the handling in the wind, it's really the flight controller that will dictate whether you are getting quick/smooth enough corrections to handle it properly - and especially to get usable footage out of a camera.

Sleepy could comment more on this - but I have realized that the reactions of Multiwii (even tuned pretty well) is not the same as the SuperX. I'm sure each FC is different in its own way...just have to try them all

 

[Jpdeuce]

I established this objective (flight time & payload) after reading the specs on the Matrix: 20-25 minutes with a 6S 8000Mah power system flying a GoPro on a two axis gimbal. It folds for ease of storage and is a solid machine in windy conditions.

That Matrix looks sweet, but alas it is definitely not in the budget I was trying to stick to. Very cool and capable machine though. You should be able to duplicate similar results by putting something together yourself. The kit would be nice though, and it's a cool looking mchine. If you like that look, I think it looks similar to the TBS Discovery. You could maybe throw RCT800 arms on the Discovery and start building something similar. I like those sleek arms though of the Tarot and the ones the Matrix has.

I unfortunately don't have any parts to pull from. I'm starting from scratch. So, just figuring out the best way to go on my first adventure into this. Getting excited though. I also don't have the space/time/money to have a MR for every different kind of flying I might want to do. If/when I build my next one, I will probably try and tackle the DIY frame route with a KK and see just how cheaply I could build one that flies. That may be fun.

Someday though I'll get back on the track of building one for a Nex5 or DSLR type setup. I will probably be more prepared for it then as well.

 

[Level Flight]

Seems like you are both on the right path. The only thing I would mention is that although the frame can contribute to the handling in the wind, it's really the flight controller that will dictate whether you are getting quick/smooth enough corrections to handle it properly - and especially to get usable footage out of a camera. Sleepy could comment more on this - but I have realized that the reactions of Multiwii (even tuned pretty well) is not the same as the SuperX. I'm sure each FC is different in its own way...just have to try them all

Good to know as this is a learning curve for me too. I still don't fully grasp the influence the Tx adds to the FC equation but that will come over time, no doubt. I have a Naza M V2 but if I didn't I'd be looking at the Pixelhawk which will be my next FC....another learning curve!

 

[Level Flight]

That Matrix looks sweet, but alas it is definitely not in the budget I was trying to stick to. Very cool and capable machine though. You should be able to duplicate similar results by putting something together yourself. The kit would be nice though, and it's a cool looking mchine. If you like that look, I think it looks similar to the TBS Discovery. You could maybe throw RCT800 arms on the Discovery and start building something similar. I like those sleek arms though of the Tarot and the ones the Matrix has. I unfortunately don't have any parts to pull from. I'm starting from scratch. So, just figuring out the best way to go on my first adventure into this. Getting excited though. I also don't have the space/time/money to have a MR for every different kind of flying I might want to do. If/when I build my next one, I will probably try and tackle the DIY frame route with a KK and see just how cheaply I could build one that flies. That may be fun. Someday though I'll get back on the track of building one for a Nex5 or DSLR type setup. I will probably be more prepared for it then as well.

If it was autumn heading into winter I would probably go this route and take the time to experiment and figure out a working solution. But since it is spring heading into summer I'd like to spend more time in the air and less time at the work bench solving problems........I'm willing to pay for some proven R&D to give me that seasonal advantage. Hopefully come this fall there will be some new players in the quad market with 'heavy lift' duration machines, looking forward to that.

 

[Motopreserve]

I was very tempted by the pixhawk. Ended up going with the superX for a very similar reason to your last post. Spring is coming and I want footage, not fiddling. This winter I took on the multiwii Pro3. Very cool and limitless tweaking. But then it was time to build a good, solid platform that could perform when needed. There will always be tweaking with any of these choices, but some MUCH less

Also, I think the Tx is less of an influence on the flight characteristics, and more to do with what people are comfortable with. As long as it has good feel to the sticks, and enough channels to get it done, you should be fine with anything you like (or can afford!).

 

[Level Flight]

There are so many choices for FC units that for me it was daunting for quite a while, only now after burning through endless (I won't tell you how many) evenings on the web am I beginning to make sense of the whole picture. I was thinking it would be helpful to give different packages a specific category name for quick reference, this would mostly pertain to kits, ARF and RTF packages, for example: FPV 1 Heavy lifters of 5kg+ with a minimum 60+ minutes FPV 2: 3-5kg, 30+ minutes FPV 3: 1-3kg, 20-30 minutes FPV 4: All the rest I'm borrowing the idea from designations which evolved in the pod & boom market, the progenitor’s of multi rotor craft. After they became truly flyable with the introduction of gyro’s the second major accomplishment was the inverted hover, and model and radio manufacturers were quick to point out their products were 'inverted capable' as it set them apart, making them more desirable. The next major plateau was the 3D phenomenon which firmly established another threshold of capability to which pilots aggressively flocked. It remains the definitive standard for this design.....a large group which is progressively finding itself to be in fact a large branch of the RC tree, rather than the tree itself. Multi rotor craft are taking over and I don’t see that changing in the near to mid future. FPV is a relevant term because most multi’s will at some point be outfitted with a camera, although it certainly isn’t the only flying approach with this design. I suppose my point with this rambling babble is to point out once the dust settles a bit the hobby will bind itself to classifications which represent true capabilities rather other than simply frame size, for example. It would prove helpful to many I would think.

 

[Level Flight]

I really don't want to get off track any more than we have already. But this is just weird with all the engineers around here. You like Neve? Take a look at THIS. It's the studio I learned at - and it was truly a one of a kind Neve. I worked on a lot of boards - nothing even came close to this. JP, you get your Cadillac yet?

What a beautiful studio, lucky you! It still sends shivers down my back whenever I enter that space, something so hallowed about it in some way. And magic happens there, of course. Nothing quite like kicking back after a long session and listening to the final mix.

 

[Motopreserve]

What a beautiful studio, lucky you! It still sends shivers down my back whenever I enter that space, something so hallowed about it in some way. And magic happens there, of course. Nothing quite like kicking back after a long session and listening to the final mix.

Have you been to/worked at the Magic Shop????

RE: Transmitters.

I understand and what you're saying about the predecessors to the MR, but I think for the most part (or completely) the performance of the MR is out of the hands of the Tx. The pilot, sure. But really the FC is controller the where and why of these craft more than the features of a Tx. I dove in and bought an expensive Futaba for these MRs. Honestly, other than the quality of the servos and sticks (more precise?) , and the number of Aux channels I have - I don't think it's any different than a $50 Turnigy. There are no "features on my Tx that the turnigy doesn't have - except the ability to show telemetry (to the tune of $100s more in ad-on sensors).

I don't regret it - I like the quality just fine - and I need the multiple channels. But they didn't take my money and write a decent manual with it - that's for sure!

 

[Level Flight]

Never been there, wish I had, a phenomenal client list to be sure. I cut my teeth and spent most of my time in London based facilities. I like the fact the MR world doesn't lock you into specific Tx features and capabilities, I always felt kind of forced into that and somewhat regretted the time I had to spend programming my various units. This once peripheral hobby has evolved into a business concern of magnitude......with a mainstream future.

 

[Level Flight]

How are you getting paragraph separations in your messages......? I can't get that figured out.

 

[Motopreserve]

How are you getting paragraph separations in your messages......? I can't get that figured out.

Just double space does it for me

i cut cut my teeth at that studio. Phenomenal gear, gear atmosphere.

 

[Jpdeuce]

Are you editing on your phone or tablet? Using the app or the website?

Not doing anything special except hitting enter/return.

 

[Motopreserve]

Are you editing on your phone or tablet? Using the app or the website?

Not doing anything special except hitting enter/return.

this is forum causes havoc with apple ios. But return definitely works.

prime example, I didn't type the "is" in the sentence above. Some type of spell check/forum snafu. Annoying.

 

[Level Flight]

Fruity computers. Fruity computers (double space entered after first line).

 

[Level Flight]

That Matrix looks sweet, but alas it is definitely not in the budget I was trying to stick to. Very cool and capable machine though. You should be able to duplicate similar results by putting something together yourself. The kit would be nice though, and it's a cool looking mchine. If you like that look, I think it looks similar to the TBS Discovery. You could maybe throw RCT800 arms on the Discovery and start building something similar. I like those sleek arms though of the Tarot and the ones the Matrix has. I unfortunately don't have any parts to pull from. I'm starting from scratch. So, just figuring out the best way to go on my first adventure into this. Getting excited though. I also don't have the space/time/money to have a MR for every different kind of flying I might want to do. If/when I build my next one, I will probably try and tackle the DIY frame route with a KK and see just how cheaply I could build one that flies. That may be fun. Someday though I'll get back on the track of building one for a Nex5 or DSLR type setup. I will probably be more prepared for it then as well.

Since we're talking spare parts do you have your charging system? I need to upgrade to a 1KW system because the one I have can't charge large 6S LiPo's fast enough. Hadn't thought of selling it but figured I'd ask just in case you're in need, I'd do you a reasonably deal....a very good system (Alinco DM-330 MV P.S., Hyperion 610i Duo (180W x 2)). The rectangular shapes are two sets of 720Mah 12v gel cells (4 total) which allow charging half a dozen 3S LiPo's in the field. I'll probably keep those for my UPS...too expensive to ship and only about $40 from your local alarm company.

 

[Jpdeuce]

Sleepy must be deep in moving hell at the moment. His PM's are full and haven't heard from him in a couple days. Hopefully we hear from him soon. Maybe somebody should go check on him.