Muti rotor on film crew

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Dave_Fullmer

Member
Hello to all extremely hand-eye coordinated
I’ve been invited by a documentary film director to use my ultralight aircraft as a camera platform for the low altitude aerial sequences of an upcoming project that covers territory from New York to Utah. I'm enthused about this project but not enthused about trailering, assembling and dissembling my aircraft many times all across the US. I'm suggesting that we use a multi-rotor RC and loose the full scale hassle altogether.

Here are my limitations: Budget of less than $2500, Very little RC flight experience.

Here are our assets: I've flown stick and rudder ultralight for 20 years. We already have a camera: "GoPro Hero" which only weighs 6 oz although I don't believe its "live view" capable.

Photo missions will consist of less than 10 minutes flight time from approx 300 AGL doing slow fly-overs or pans. We don't need professional "going into the business" gear but we definitely don't want this to look amateurish. We "hit the road" the first week in May. Any suggestions you all might have as to kits, motors, batteries, camera mounts, sim programs, physiological counseling etc would be much appreciated!

Dave Fullmer
 

R

RTRyder

Merlin of Multirotors
Dave_Fullmer said:
Hello to all extremely hand-eye coordinated
I’ve been invited by a documentary film director to use my ultralight aircraft as a camera platform for the low altitude aerial sequences of an upcoming project that covers territory from New York to Utah. I'm enthused about this project but not enthused about trailering, assembling and dissembling my aircraft many times all across the US. I'm suggesting that we use a multi-rotor RC and loose the full scale hassle altogether.

Here are my limitations: Budget of less than $2500, Very little RC flight experience.

Here are our assets: I've flown stick and rudder ultralight for 20 years. We already have a camera: "GoPro Hero" which only weighs 6 oz although I don't believe its "live view" capable.

Photo missions will consist of less than 10 minutes flight time from approx 300 AGL doing slow fly-overs or pans. We don't need professional "going into the business" gear but we definitely don't want this to look amateurish. We "hit the road" the first week in May. Any suggestions you all might have as to kits, motors, batteries, camera mounts, sim programs, physiological etc would be much appreciated!

Dave Fullmer
Click to expand...

Hi Dave, welcome aboard!

You may want to start with the counseling because getting pro quality video from a multi can drive you crazy at times ;)

I'm sure you've heard the way to go is to buy a Mikrokopter and for the most part that's true to a certain degree, and it's also the most expensive route to take, I know, I'm there. Just as an FYI, the GoPro Hero HD is capable of live video out with the latest firmware update, so depending on which you have and how long you've had it, you may want to check that out on GoPro's website.

As for your project, with the budget and RC experience you have it's going to be tough to pull something together that will get you the results you want in a package that's both portable and easy for a beginner to get good results from. You do have a big advantage in understanding flight and how controls work which is a lot more than the average person getting into this arena has for knowledge.

For starters you can go look at the new thread I just posted in the Aerial Photography and Video section of my most recent video test flight with a homebuilt Hoverfly quad to get an idea of what is possible with current state of the art. This is certainly a setup that you could build within your budget, but you would have to build it as no one sells it as a complete kit or in RTF form. Given your project and the exposure it could generate for a vendor, you might want to contact George or Al at Hoverfly and see if they would be willing to assist, they're an American company based in Florida and manufacture the Hoverfly Pro control board intended for A/P use.

Good luck and again, welcome.

Ken
 

Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
Hi Everyone,
I spoke to Dave yesterday and had a chance to hear him out regarding what he's trying to do. His aerial video will be edited into ground based video that will make up the lion's share of the content. The aerial parts will be limited so I think he'll be more than capable of being successful.
The gopro is well within the load carrying capabilities of the Mikrokopter hexa and the quad for that matter. The Okto is way overkill.
I also mentioned to Dave that the XAircraft X650 quad is far enough along in the design process that it's an option as well. It will certainly carry the gopro and fly the ten minutes or more that he's looking for.
The gopro is useable, so check that box Dave. Now to figure out what to fly and how to get it flying.
I promised Dave lots of input so let's see what we can do for him.
I'd say the project is doable. any yay's or nay's?
Bart
 

X

Xaircraft USA

Member
Please feel free to phone me at Xiarcraft USA, My name is Jeffery, I will PM you my cell number . . . I own Xaircraft USA and also own a Mikrokopter Hexa XL heavy lift machine !~!
 

X

Xaircraft USA

Member
I own a VERY tiny company call Xaircraft USA, we sell an exclusive but very affordable multirotor copter "Quad" Know as the X650 ...It is larger than the Mikrokopter standard quad version and has lengthy flight times also at many times less the cost and also 1000 times easier for a beginner than mikrokopters, The X650 is almost entirely Plug-n-play. I am a multi-time National Competition pilot and have taught 100's of people to fly helicopters and now many multi-copter owners. If you need help ...call me! Jeffery Wright 606-205-3021 and please check out http://xaircraftusa.com
 

Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
Dave,
On top of the multi-rotor itself, figure you'll have to buy;
a video transmitter and receiver plus an antenna or two for the receiver ($500 max)
batteries for the multi-copter and video receiver (depending on what MRC you buy, maybe $125 to $250)
an RC transmitter/receiver ($200 to $400 depending on what you choose)
maybe a few miscellaneous switches, cords, straps, doo-dads, etc. ($75)
camera mount (although the Xaircraft quads include a basic mount), ($250)
maybe a protective case (buy or make) for the RC transmitter and multi-rotor since you'll be on the road the whole time ($00.00, find some scraps in the cabinet shop)
then there's the aerial vehicle, a basic Mikrokopter Hexa with most of the soldering done is about $2000 plus shipping (no GPS hold or Navi option). if you ask around you can probably find the same thing second hand for less and probably get a radio with it. The XAircraft X650 is $1000 with the gps and altitude hold capabilities plus it has a camera mount and shutter release built into it.
by the end of the day when everyone's home from work you'll probably get a few more opinions on this.
a decent RC simulator should be the first purchase once you make the decision to go this route.
regards,
bart
 

matwelli

matwelli

Member
Just throwing something in the mix (sorry fellow multirotor deciples)

Flying skill = Beginner/novice/not much

Height = 300ft AGL

I feel that your most sucessfull option may be an EPP flying wing , around 48-60" wingspan.

Reasons

Easy-er to learn to fly
Easy-er to see and for orientation
Rugged, handle rough landings/mishaps
Wind - up to 30mph is dooable, up to 15mph is comfortable, flying wings dont get pushed around by the wind(no fuselage)
Simple 1 motor, 1 esc, 2 servos

Im not saying its the best AP platform, but given the circumstances , it may be the best "fit"
 

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Dave_Fullmer

Member
How about that wing thing?

I always like the idea of simpler. All the moving parts in a helo make me a little nervous to be honest. But what about the altitude hold or hold position and pan requirements of my photo missions? Does the wing fly slow enough that, with a wide angle lense it looks like it's holding position. Does the wing have enough payload to handle a 6 oz camera, remote shutter & video transmitter? Can the camera etc be mounted such that the aircraft will not be in the shot, yet not adversly affect CG balance?

Thanks for everyone's help. This is great!
 

Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
dave,
matt and i swapped pm's about the wing idea and my reply was, throw it out there and see where it goes. the strength of multi-rotors in aerial photography has been their ability to sit in one place for an extended period of time and take video or pics, often high def, while shooting images back to the ground. adjustments can be made to position or camera angle but the gps position hold and altitude hold functions are unlike anything that has been available up until multi-rotors. the flying wing will definitely give you some options for carrying the camera and sending images back to the ground while you're taping but you'll have to do your work in passes much like traditional aerial photographers have worked from airplanes since the days of orville and wilbur (we'll connect those two characters back to the story in another post). i personally don't think that the camera will be as steady as it would be in a hovering multi rotor helicopter but i'm not an expert on either of the two options being discussed so we'll just have to sit and see what the opinions are that are offered. i'm starting on an Xaircraft X650 tonight and so far i think it's a great option for you. i may change my mind after i fly it but that would be contrary to everything jeffery wright has told me about the X650 and i'm beginning to think he's a pretty alright dude so i suspect it's going to fly just fine.
let's see what other comments we get regarding the wing idea and you can take it from there. ok?
one last thing, i suspect the wing would be better flown as a first-person-video set-up where you fly it as if you're in the cockpit using the video image being sent from the camera. with the multi rotor helicopter you would be able to do the same thing but you could also fly it line-of-sight like most other RC vehicles and also display the image from the camera while you're flying to help frame your shots.
bart
 

Droider

Droider

Drone Enthusiast
Dave

Only been flying since November last year. Filmed this over christmas with a £500 multirotor and a Panasonic TZ7.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoBzJ-5QjDc

Dont think the GoPro is man enough for a project like you describe unless sun is shining as its low light capability is very poor. I have been filming Extreme mountain biking for years and have tried most of the new HD mini cams and they all suffer with the same problem in low light. The lenses are designed for close up action not ariels.. my opinion. There is a new lens mod that is cheap but I have not had chance to try it yet. I think RTryder has though. I have found that cameras like the Pansonic TZ range is far superior.

I just got my ne ADX3 up in the air at the weekend and flimed it with my iPhone and the onboard camera was a GoPro.. check it out here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIqN5EUY818

My ten pennyworth.. Oh if you want, I'll:) pack me bags and bring my stuff over to help you... all I need is a bed grub and a few beers!! :)
 


1

1001 Copters

Member
Dave_Fullmer said:
Hello to all extremely hand-eye coordinated
I’ve been invited by a documentary film director to use my ultralight aircraft as a camera platform for the low altitude aerial sequences of an upcoming project that covers territory from New York to Utah. I'm enthused about this project but not enthused about trailering, assembling and dissembling my aircraft many times all across the US. I'm suggesting that we use a multi-rotor RC and loose the full scale hassle altogether.
Click to expand...

You are speaking about lots of travel, You should use a multicopter frame that is foldable. These things are costly and fragile, so try to ask for foldable frames, easy to deploy and to transport.
If you don't wan tto waste time finding the good construction (what frame, what motors, what propellers, what camera mount etc...), you should ask someone with a little experience in this doamin to build you something.
 

D

Dave_Fullmer

Member
Hey Droider
Thanks for the links. I'll show them to the director. The beers might be a problem since this project is being funded by Brigham Young University. They'd probably spring for soda pop and green jello however!
DF
 

matwelli

matwelli

Member
As I said I sugested the flying wing as I thought it was best fit given the limited pilot time, and would do the same job as your ultralight aircraft would have provided :)

Wing will easily handle 6oz , and capable of flying relatively slow (20-30 mph)

The multicopter will be best fit as far as being able to sit in one place. and take the shot

Looking forward to the development on this multirotor

Dave_Fullmer said:
I always like the idea of simpler. All the moving parts in a helo make me a little nervous to be honest. But what about the altitude hold or hold position and pan requirements of my photo missions? Does the wing fly slow enough that, with a wide angle lense it looks like it's holding position. Does the wing have enough payload to handle a 6 oz camera, remote shutter & video transmitter? Can the camera etc be mounted such that the aircraft will not be in the shot, yet not adversly affect CG balance?

Thanks for everyone's help. This is great!
Click to expand...
 

Droider

Droider

Drone Enthusiast
Bart in NJ said:
dave,
did you make this post about the gopro before or after seeing ken's new video with the lens mod?

http://www.multirotorforums.com/showthread.php?88-Video-from-Hoverfly-quad

bart
Click to expand...
Hi Bart.. I saw the modified video of Kens as well as one from a guy in Florida. The GoPro is a good camera as long as the light is good and stable, any quick changes in lighting conditions or low light conditions let it down.

As an example this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krnKtD0l5RU

was shot on a sony SD hiRs bullet cam. watch how fast the reaction time is as we go in and out of trees. The GoPro could not cope with that. Not that you would be flying in and out of trees at the speeds we are achieving but woodland shots or evening shoots would be difficult to get the correct exposures with the GoPro.

dave
 

Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
that's great information, thanks for posting. good music too, BTW.

Dave F.
Are you any closer to a decision on this?
Bart
 

D

Dave_Fullmer

Member
Hi all
Am I any closer? If you believe the reply's I've been getting on the Microcopter thread, I'm crazy to even be THINKING about this with my lack of experience. You guys have given me some encouragement although how I do and how much I do on the simulator seems to be of first concern. What simulator software/hardware should I be looking for? The GoPro Hero is a given. We already have that. We're not expecting professional video results, just a few seconds here and there of "better-than-amiture" video to add to the ground based stuff. We won't have the money to actually spend 'till March so we have to have a plan B which at this point is loading my Quicksilver MXLII into the trailer and heading off. (I really don't have much confidence in the weather balloon idea). Personally I'd much rather take a multi-copter but only if my sim performance over the next month can boulster my confidence. So which software/hardware do you guys recommend and can it be purchased second hand?

Dave Fullmer
 


Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
dave,
if you go to ebay and search "Real Flight 3.5" you'll come up with stuff like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/RealFlight-G3-5...978?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35afac08fa

for about $100 you'll get a controller with a USB plug and a bunch of helicopter options. If you can fly a Coaxial helicopter with confidence you'll be fine with the multi-rotor. if you can fly a regular single rotor heli with any kind of competence then you'll really crank with the multi.

i have real flight 3.5 and fly it all the time. there are less expensive options but i have no idea how well they fly.

bart
 

D

Dave_Fullmer

Member
Hi Bart
An RC friend who wasn't using it, loaned me RealFlight 4.5 with the controller. I've been practising a bit over the last couple days. I get a KEEerror on launch for which it tells me I may have to re-insall the app, but once I click past that the program runs. Don't know if that's a problem and my friend knows very little about the program. So far, I've found the single axis, counter-rotating Helimax EZ exremely easy to fly compared to the nearly impossible characteristics of the several coaxials in the application. I've "crashed" many thousands of $ worth of coaxials! Dare I suppose mult-rotors are as easy as the Helimax? Another wrinkle in my photo mission plan is that Friday, my boss left a message on my cel phone that he's laying me off, after 25 years with the same company. I helped build this company and did all the design work on it's product and marketing and now this. Sheesh! Dave
 

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