DJI Support

Emowillcox

Member
Seems like the more I read the more I get confused on which platform to go with. I was really close to buying the DJI system but had just a few questions that I thought the DJI guys could answer. So I tried emailing Robert, but got no response. Then I tried emailing the email address on the DJI web site. Was thinking the guys in China probably take care of that address, but still got no response.
Was wondering if anyone who has the new system has been getting their questions answered?
I was trying to find out about the GPS and if there were going to be any fixes to get it to respond faster. Now I'm reading about the problems in the wind and heavy lifting.
Guess i'm back up on that fence trying to decide which platform to go with.
 

Droider

Drone Enthusiast
I am surprised that they aint responded to you. Geoff at QC.co.uk has his GPS lock in about a miniute. I gave had a fly of it and it is VERY stable on the hexa he had but it had no weight on it.. What are the issues with lifting weight and wind ?
 

BorisS

Drone Enthusiast
Emowillcox all i can say wait. Really wait at the moment. No one with a bigger frame has been successful at showing acceptable vids with the slightest bit of wind in action. That could all be due to the used ESCs or the next firmware which will allow more config options. The potential seems to be there.
 

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
aside from flight issues, the discussion on RCG seems to indicate that the business model is unstable as well. there are some unhappy people right now.
 

BorisS

Drone Enthusiast
japp i agree. At the moment I feel like they are planning on selling a full system and WK-M will only work with their specs and components to the fullest. But they just thought lets sell the FC first and make some cash on the basis of the cool promo vids we have. Still hopping this is going to work itself out !
 

Dixter

Member
I talked wiht DJI yesterday. Robert may not have answered the email as he was/is busy putting the WK-M on a large frame and said he was going to be doing alot of testing on the WK-M and a large frame today... he wants to see what the issue is and be able to talk to the factory boys if there is an issue... he said he hopes to have video by Thursday...
 

Emowillcox

Member
Morning Droider that is good news to hear about the GPS lock. That was and is a big concern for me and the type of use I wanna use my next platform for. Really was very excited to buy the DJI system but not responding to my emails was the first red flag and now I seeing the troubles Boris and RTryder are having do have me putting my purchase on hold. Looks like DJI is going through some growing pains now with their new product. Hope Boris and RTRyder can get it worked out in the mean time guess i'll continue to sit on the side line and wait to make my next purchase. Wonder if the DJI guys are going to become active here? Maybe they are too busy trying to put out the fires else where.
 

RTRyder

Merlin of Multirotors
DJI has what appear to be support people doing some replies to the RCG thread. There are some issues at the moment that will eventually get resolved (I hope) that prevent it from being a good all around APV platform. I have been doing extensive testing and so far have used the WKM on a MK standard quad frame with 925kv motors and 10 x 5 Graupner props on a single 3S 5000 mah pack, the Y6 with Avrotos and 11 x 5 Graupners and now with the Y6 converted to a flat hex. The weight of the test quad configuration is a bit less than 1/2 what the hex it sits on now weighs and the all around performance of the WKM while on the quad was extremely impressive, it wasn't until I moved it to the Y6 and started flying with a GoPro recording that the problems began to show.

The main problem as of right now is the inability of the WKM to maintain a decent level of stability in wind, I have a number of videos I could show to illustrate the point. The big difference I see is the Mk tends to float in the wind and move around but it can still deliver acceptable video if everything is working right. With the WKM the amount of wind hitting the multi induces a wobble the intensity of which varies in direct proportion to the speed of the air hitting it. I have had the hex at tree top level with gusts that made it questionable if it was going to flip or not, that's how bad the wobble was. A large amount of trial and error testing has resulted in settings that provide a lot more stability in the same conditons but still not anything that would be useable video in those conditions even doing post stabilization at the maximum that I can do with software.

The root of the problem it appears is twofold, one the WKM algorithims are optimized for smaller and lighter multis apparently and also optimized to force holding GPS position regardless of conditions and it does that very well at the expense of stability of the platform for AV use. I have found that if I do not use GPS hold along with the latest settings I've tried in windy conditions I can get video that is useable after stabilization though nothing as good as what the WKM can deliver in calm air. That's the part that just boggles my mind, that it can deliver almost flawless, no post processing needed video in calm conditions and totally unuseable video when the wind goes above a couple mph breeze.

The DJI technical contributors on RCG do not seem to have a good grasp of what it takes to do proper APV with a multirotor, they have suggested the problem is reaction time of the motors due to too large of a prop. When following that advice didn't make any difference they then said the props were too small and they needed to be much larger which to me is a direct contradiction of the first advice their suggestion being to use 15 inch props with motors producing 700 grams of thrust. Don't know what they were thinking there but 700 grams of thrust per motor with a 15 inch prop is not only going to have a very slow response time to speed change commands, but itsn't anywhere near the amount of lift required to put a 4 kilo APV multi in the air. The next suggestion was to reduce the weight by at least a kilo! I currently have a GoPro on the frame, if anything the weight is going to increase with a decent camera, so clearly they don't grasp how a real APV multirotor is built and what it takes to fly good equipment.

This is just some of what has been going on. The latest thing that has really ticked off a lot of people, me included, is they are now letting just about anyone become a distributor and have now dropped the price to $200 less than the "introductory" price first set two weeks ago when the first customer units became available. I gave them a lot of crap for that over on RCG, not a way to maintain a happy customer base that's for sure. They also say they are developing their own ESC for use with the WKM that will have a 600hz refresh rate which is technically impossible to do as the PWM frame at 2us cannot fit into anything higher than 500hz and even then its pushing the limits of what is possible.

So the best advice is as Boris has stated, wait until things settle out and then see what direction this is all taking before purchasing anything. It seems that it may require some amount of component change to get large APV craft to be stable in all conditions though at this point they don't really know what those changes should be. They have also said they're going to add some tuning capabilites to the software to make it more friendly to larger and heavier frames but that will come at the expense of the position hold. Seems you can't have both super tight position hold and really good autoleveling with altitude hold unless you're flying a small light frame. We'll see how well that works in a week or two...

Ken
 
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MICROFOE

Member
I am going to wait and see what happens with the WKM before I buy anything. I was hoping that it would be everything they said it would be. The plug and play part is what really interested me about the WKM. I don't mind the assembly part of putting everything together but the science project part of HK, of having to solder everything together is what put me off. I am going to give them a little time to get everything straight and then buy the best FC.

Emo, when are you going to show me your system?
 

DennyR

Active Member
Getting large 6 kilo models to be as stable as light small ones is a tough nut to crack. I should know as I have spent more than a year working on that function. I cracked it with custom PID algorithms that work within the AC2 code. AC 2.x.x is very close to being perfect but it still has some glitches in some of the autonomous modes. Nose-in circle being one such AP feature that does work. Optic flow is also close to release. If my new DJI can hover like that out of the box I will be very happy.
 

Emowillcox

Member
HI Denny... I have followed alot of your post so i'm excited to see with your experience what your opinion will be about the DJI set up.
 

DennyR

Active Member
EMO
I hope to have it tomorrow and I have a model prepared ready for it so fingers crossed. What I currently use is great but expensive, intensively complicated and heavy so I have a strong feeling about this stuff. BTW I am also an ex control line modeler. mostly team race. but I go back to the sixties. It later became bank and yank with pylon racing. Good luck with the combat. Sadly control line will never catch on in Cyprus. Everybody has a jet. After ten years of aerial photography without any serious competition I now have some in my home town, so It is time to get busy again and hopefully raise the bar.
 
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Hi RTRyder,

Thanks for the very informative post, I have a question for you (and anyone else), : I have already got the wkm, so no sitting on the fence there, but am now faced with the dilema of an okto or a hexa build. I will be using the AV200/360 system for apv and am not too sure which way to go. I,d have thought the octo to be more stable but now am unsure ? What do you suggest octo/hexa with apv in mind. (My main concern is the weight involved and weather the hexa will be able to deliver in terms of payload.

Matt
 

Emowillcox

Member
HI Denny... I knew we had a special connection.. you use to fly control how cool! I've done the RC thing too. I almost let some friends talk me into flying pylon.... but just kept it to RC combat.
I have been watching some of your videos and they are cool. What kind of expensive aerial rig have you been using? Is AP your full time gig or maybe I read you do some video work too?
Well good luck with the WOOkong. I think I might be following in your footsteps soon.
Cyprus is a pretty big tourist place? Once multicopters gets more organized we should hold a meeting there.. I bet it is nice there :02.47-tranquillity::frog::nevreness:

EMO
I hope to have it tomorrow and I have a model prepared ready for it so fingers crossed. What I currently use is great but expensive, intensively complicated and heavy so I have a strong feeling about this stuff. BTW I am also an ex control line modeler. mostly team race. but I go back to the sixties. It later became bank and yank with pylon racing. Good luck with the combat. Sadly control line will never catch on in Cyprus. Everybody has a jet. After ten years of aerial photography without any serious competition I now have some in my home town, so It is time to get busy again and hopefully raise the bar.
 

Emowillcox

Member
HI Matt looks like your going with a great platform with the DJI. Sounds like things are coming around for the DJI stuff and that its going to be a
great platform.
I see your trying to figure out how many motors to use. I don't have the dji system yet, but I thought I read it only had plugs for 6 and if you want to run 8 at this time you'll have to have the futaba radio with the sbus in order to run 8 motors.
 

DennyR

Active Member
Matt
The more motors you have the less is the overall efficiency in terms of endurance. That is cast in stone. However to help with your choice you can only have an okto and camera mount outputs if you are using a ppm sum receiver signal. If you are using pwm then hexa is all you can have at the same time as mount outputs. I personally would go for a heavy lift Quad.
 

An octo is more stable and offers 1-2 motor redundancy. If you are looking for agility but no redundancy go for a quad.
If you are gonna use any TX other than Futaba, with the DJI for an octo+gimbal you need a Futaba SBE-1 S Bus Encoder. Or pic up a Picloc :)
 

Cheers DennyR,

That helps me loads in my decision. It going to be a hexa then because of the apv, Was going to use an octo and then use external stabilisers for the gimbal but I think I,ll go for the middle option being a hexa with cam gimble through the wkm all in one !!

Hopefully the overall efficiency is not to bad I shall post once I have results,

Again tks

Matt

Matt
The more motors you have the less is the overall efficiency in terms of endurance. That is cast in stone. However to help with your choice you can only have an okto and camera mount outputs if you are using a ppm sum receiver signal. If you are using pwm then hexa is all you can have at the same time as mount outputs. I personally would go for a heavy lift Quad.
 

Thanks Emo,

I have decided to go with the Hexa, it seems to be the best system for me right now I shall post results as they evolve,

Many thanks

Matt

HI Matt looks like your going with a great platform with the DJI. Sounds like things are coming around for the DJI stuff and that its going to be a
great platform.
I see your trying to figure out how many motors to use. I don't have the dji system yet, but I thought I read it only had plugs for 6 and if you want to run 8 at this time you'll have to have the futaba radio with the sbus in order to run 8 motors.
 

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