I am still on the fence about jumping into Cinestar. My dilemma is we mostly do feature films which requires using cine glass. We mainly use 18 to 50 mm Red, Cooke or Leica primes. It appears that Quadrocopter is fine throwing up videos of lifting Epics and small compact cars, but falls short of officially endorsing the CS8 for pro work. It seems the details are left to the buyer and this troubles me. Am I way off base here?
CS8 for cinema
- Thread starter Str8 Up
- Start date
Provided that you are within the specified weight limit for the copter and the gimbal, and that the camera is very well balanced in the gimbal, then I reckon you'll be good to go. Any size of frame/gimbal seems to need careful and patient "tuning" to get any particular combo operating optimally. The one "exception" is the Zenmuse which avoids that need by disallowing any variation from the factory-tuned setup. On this basis I guess it's understandable that any dealer/mfg is going to be cautious about offering guaranteed results. As with the flying itself, satisfactory gimbal results depend as much on the user as the equipment.
Having said all that - is the performance/results of the cine lenses going to be visible at all on footage that will probably be going through post-stab anyway? Stick a nice "lightweight" Canon prime on there?
Having said all that - is the performance/results of the cine lenses going to be visible at all on footage that will probably be going through post-stab anyway? Stick a nice "lightweight" Canon prime on there?
Thanks for taking time to reply. Unfortunately the use of cine primes is non-negotiable. Our current SR rigs have no problems doing this but the MR could open up some new shot opportunities. Historically this type of equipment and guarantees usually aren't used in the same sentence and I don't expect that. I would just like an OEM recommendation on what has the best chance of success with an Epic and a 5 lb. Lens.
Personally - I'd "talk to Tabb" 
DucktileMedia
Drone Enthusiast
If you talk to Tabb you will be told to buy a cinestar8 and a freefly of course. Thats like going to a car dealer and asking what car to buy. Not that its a bad recommendation but it is biased. I'm curious, what are the limitations with your SRH? I kinda know the answers to this but would like to hear from someone actually doing this. You will have plusses and minuses either way. Obviously safety is a big issue with a SRH but all in all, these are all dangerous to some extent. Personally I would take a SRH if I had the payload as it still offers auto rotation, better visual orientation, wind performance and efficiency with the added weights. But multis are definitely a close second. You will want to get the very best of everything which is obvioulsy gonna cost money. Just be aware that no matter how much you spend, you shouldnt plan on getting a turn key system. These things are endless work and tuning no matter how well it runs. The frame is the least important feature of the heli although it is nice to match what ever gimbal you want to use with the frame. I'm sure this doesnt help much but just make sure your stuff is well insured. Gravity always wins.
Tabb Firchau
Member
Not sure why you have such a chip on your shoulder regarding me and Freefly??? Remember before I started Freefly systems I was just a guy who did filming and was looking for good equipment to use like everyone else. I invested everything I had into making some good designs to use myself....then later decided to sell them. As always I am most interested in people being successful in their aerial filming endeavors, whether it be with single rotor heli, multi rotor, CineStar, or DJI. I have wasted thousands of hours on products that do not work well, or don't work at all. Our aim with Freefly was to save people the thousands of hours and let them get strait to the enjoyable aspects of aerial filming. Part of the reason people are having success with the CineStar line of products is because before they ever hit the market I have usually been using them on film sets for months if not years. Our stuff is not perfect, but I am proud of it.
I would just ask that you not paint me in a light I do not deserve.
Tabb
Tabb Firchau
Member
Just a note, we have not been pushing the EPIC yet on the CineStar 8 because the MK electronics are marginal for the task. We will be releasing and EPIC specific CineStar in the near future. I have been flying it with the C500 for the last month and the EPIC for months before that.
Best,
Tabb
DucktileMedia
Drone Enthusiast
Fair enough. I dont have an issue with you I just wanted to make sure Str8 Up knows you are biased toward your own product. He may have not known you're affiliated with Quadrocopter and own Freefly. I'm not picking on you, sorry if it came across that way.
I have to hand it to Tabb for the Radian Stabi, Havent heard anything bad about it except for the price, but you got to pay to play. Have my Radian coming, and im really excited. I have a question for you Tabb, Are the freefly servos only good to 6V or can they run higher for larger payloads like the Epic and so forth. On my SRH I love the High Voltage setup it just seems to work alot better all the way around. Im sure whatever decision you came to is a good one. The Frame and the Gimbal look really nice and are lighter than anything I can find Swinging 14 inch props, just the right size.
You are gonna find it very difficult to find a multirotor that is OEM that will lift and fly (well) an Epic with CP's...
Interesting to hear you lay out your position, Tabb. It's exactly as I had surmised it from observing your sales success and your personal composure. I'm in the process of designing a commercial frame/gimbal system myself so I can certainly concur with the effort and expense required - my workshop garbage bin fills up as quickly as my bank account empties! Hopefully we'll be "rivals" one day soon but I believe the only "way to play" in this young and fascinating field is to be totally straight and totally honest - there's no room for overselling or concealing the difficulties/responsibilities that go along with these flying machines. IME "paying forwards" always pays back... in trumps
Tabb Firchau
Member
I am certain after seeing your posts and the direction you are heading that your system will work very nicely! I agree completely on being straight, honest, and not overselling. These tenants have served me well in my filming business as it is always much better to under promise and over deliver! Overselling just means unhappy customers down the line which nobody wants.
Tabb
Tabb
Benjamin Rowland
Member
Tabb has been very supportive of our efforts from the very beginning, and I know him to be a very straightforward guy that is committed to building awesome products. I'm sure that this upcoming "Epic specific Cinestar" will be an impressive machine because he wouldn't release it otherwise.
Lanzar
Member
Flying red on cinestar in no big deal, but not on stock motors like our kw4, qc or axi ones. You need more power to be safe, Othervise even big pl primes are no big deal but you need to balance it perfectly. We build and tested at least 3 diferent configurations which were red capable. It is just precise calibration and a lot off power to do it. Well check ou facebook or internet page for more info. Cinestar frame is more than good for it but you need to check screws before you take off.
I also advise that you buy one more bottom center plate just to make it even stronger.
I also advise that you buy one more bottom center plate just to make it even stronger.
You make it sound pretty much plug and play. It's one thing to do something a few times and quite another to have something that is battle tested that you can count on, day after day. I have over 150 flights with either the Epic or Scarlet on our SR helis in a wide range of wind/weather conditions. There were a few issues that didn't crop up until many flights were logged. If you drop one of these cameras on a movie set you can kiss your chances of getting a second shot goodbye.
Thats good info Lanzar... I have been hearing people doing something similar but using Aluminum, I thought this might be a bit to heavy for how I wanted to run mine. But your suggestions for a second bottome plate is very interesting. I was also thinking that Tabb or his manufacturer along with quadrocopter are able to sell larger booms for the Cinestar allowing people to swing 15 props, Have you tryed this?
Yeah, I hear ya on reliabilty, its hard to figure out the perfect most reliable system for the amount of weight your trying lift... Man if I were you I would really wouldnt be trying to buy a multirotor to lift an Epic I would be trying to purchase one to start testing with, and leave the huge amounts of weight to the SRH, they just work and in my oppinion are the best choice for recoverability and Autorotation saving. With a Multi I feel your not going to kill someone like a big SRH, and I know because I have flown 700s 5 feet away from my face going 75 miles an hour, and if anything went wrong your not going to be around to tell about it.
So for me I like the Multis for safety, but if your already in it with the SRH then why waste the time its going to take you to master a new setup with multi. Theres alot more that could go wrong with a multi and fall from the heavens with no chance of saving, so for what your saying I would stick to your bread and butter, and get with the Big Boys to start testing for the multi. There is alot of great cameras you can pick up for testing like the mk111 or GH2 Hacked atleast for testing, then when you have a really good understanding of what system you like, and how to tune for optimal efficency like Aerilmediapros or Kopterworx has in there arsenal then can you plow the way for the rest of us to enjoy.