Hoverfly HFP/GPS and TBS Discovery frame, band combo? Something is wrong...

[wayno complaino]

Hi all, not sure if this is a 4.6 thing or just the a frame/FC incompatibility.

I've recently acquired a TBS discovery and the only FC I had laying around was a HFP/GPS. I fitted it (with some persuasion, but there is lots of space in there), updated and calibrated. The board wasn't flown since 3.? But it was flying well then. I figure its overkill for an FPV bird but what the heck, super stable and RTH with and OSD built in, what could go wrong?

Everything.

As you know the frame is asymmetric but it hovered fine and I tuned in a stable hover. That's where it ends though, everything else is weird, a fast acceleration and it give fast wobbles like too much gain, any type of decent ether forward or through prop wash gives unstable slow uncontrollable wobbles and it almost falls from the sky. No matter the gain I get both extremes.

Hovering at 10 feet and activating AH it drops like a stone only just recovering before hitting the deck, no matter the gain.

So, is it just the asymmetric motor layout, the so called flexi arms (I've since tried another FC that copes just fine) or am I missing something with the boards?

GPS lock is good, artificial horizon is good. Didn't dare try PH or RTH, the one daring FPV flight I did scared the crap out of me (and I'm a pretty good FPV pilot, quad or fixed wing).

Help!

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[wayno complaino]

Oh, one of those images the props are on wrong, I figured that out

 

[kloner]

what is the motor/prop size combo there?

 

[wayno complaino]

2830/11 1000kV (would have liked slightly lower kV but this was the lowest in UK stock)
10x3.8 APC
30A ESC
3s

 

[kloner]

that is most likely your problem. Try 8"x5" for 4s, 9x5 for 3s

http://www.team-blacksheep.com/products/product:122

the layout of the frame shouldn't be a problem, it is laid out like that to put the rear props back far enough to carry the battery the way it is mounted. I and alot of others have had a hard time fitting motors that won't try ripping it apart

when you say 2830, is that stator size or outer dimmension?

is there any heat out of one motor? how is the onboard video? is it a happy place for a cam or just flat misserable?

 

[Photronix]

At what percentage throttle does the craft hover? 25%?, 50%?

 

[wayno complaino]

that is most likely your problem. Try 8"x5" for 4s, 9x5 for 3s

http://www.team-blacksheep.com/products/product:122

the layout of the frame shouldn't be a problem, it is laid out like that to put the rear props back far enough to carry the battery the way it is mounted. I and alot of others have had a hard time fitting motors that won't try ripping it apart

Hmmm, mine ARE 10" but only 3.8 pitch.

At what percentage throttle does the craft hover? 25%?, 50%?

about 50%

 

[kloner]

that sounds normal..... what about the heat part, like a motor sucking wind.

when you set a camera on the frame and hovr, is it jello free or does it shake

might take all the props off and fire it up and feel motors for vibes

 

[wayno complaino]

The motors 'felt' ok spinning up with the props off, holding the frame in my hand, no excessive vibration. Annoyingly i didn't turn on the gopro despite it being on the to help balance it.

Props are well balanced too including the hubs.

 

[kloner]

i'd be interested to see how bad the vibes are....... through the lens.

feel them motors again after a quick hover. film it to and see what lifes like aboard

got a link to your motors?

 

[wayno complaino]

I'll try and record some onboard footage from the go pro when i can, may be a few days. And it wont be with the hoverfly as its out again now (but would be my preferred fc choice)
The motors are these...http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=28675
I also trimmed the motor shafts down so the collet sits on the bell, that way the long sticky outy shaft wont add vibrations or get bent in a crash (and the props come off easy for packing away).

I could just give up and wait for the sunsky 2216 800kVs to arrive, they are a proven motor on this frame with 10" props, just have to go 4s too.

 

[kloner]

9" or 10" but were usually talking graupners, trappy offers em for $7 a piece, pretty fair considering the performance..... discoveries can look moody when there not "just right" as far as everything working smoothly like motors, props, esc's. your gonna see alot of shaking and wobbling most likely unless them esc's are flashed with all other flight controllers. these guys swear not, but i haven't been around the hfp enough to see the difference. on a naza or cc3d 400mhz esc's are mandatory, 600mhz is better. Can turn up the gains almost double and the craft locks in

what other fc you looking to fly?

 

[kloner]

this is a perfectly setup tbs that flew hundreds of flights. one day graupner quit selling the prop adapters and a few weeks prior it flipped taking off and bent a few... broke a couple races too. see all the shaking

before that i had this thing right on the edge. when my osd showed a 60 amp draw it'd start shaking, but only then

but before i had it flying like that, i had it overpropped and it would draw 80 amp FFF, when it hit 60 amps it shook like hell

if you see something different all together say something. this is what over powering or over propping looks like

 

[wayno complaino]

Thanks kloner.

I have some APC 8x3.8 to hand, i'll throw them on and just see what happens.
I have a CC3D in there right now but i'd prefer to have that back on my small quad and the HFP/GPS back in the Disco. I cant tune the CC3D as well as i could on the other quad so maybe the motor/prop/ESC is the cause. Being as HF don't seem bothered by flashed ESC's i wasn't in a rush to do it, if i stick to the CC3D then i'll flash them for sure.
APC vs Graupner, i've read conflicting stories and it seem although people like the Graupners for FFF (and they do look cool and aggressive) it seems the APC's are more efficient and stable. I've always had good results from them before.
At the end of the day i'm going to use a proven setup and going graupner may be part of that. I'd just like to get the HF gear in there too.

 

[wayno complaino]

this was posted in responce to my enquiry on the OP forum

I'm not entirely sure the F30As are much good until you flash them... Anyone else? I know for sure the HK 10A's will not fly a quad without flashing, but they're great when you do...

Could also be an explanation, rubbish ESC firmware to start with??

 

[kloner]

i couldn't get the 450 size dji stuff to stable with either apc or 10" anything. Tried for a while....... but when you get it nailed, they sit there like a big heli, super stable, in fact far more stable than any f550 i've ever seen. I'm betting on a mechanical problem, albeit it small, something is off

 

[wayno complaino]

No doubt it'll be a 'facepalm' moment when i figure it out. I'm gonna order some 9" Graupners, sod it.

 

[Droider]

Aye Up Wayne.. long time no her..tried to catch u at Fort Bouyard but the guys on your stand said you only turn up for the parties!

What ESC's have you on it?

I was flying 3 cell but since moving to 4c my F450 is a different beast. Have you seen Quattros footage of Antur Stiniog?

Dave

 

[wayno complaino]

Aye Up Wayne.. long time no her..tried to catch u at Fort Bouyard but the guys on your stand said you only turn up for the parties!

What ESC's have you on it?

I was flying 3 cell but since moving to 4c my F450 is a different beast. Have you seen Quattros footage of Antur Stiniog?

Dave

Hey Dave, Ive been deep in the world of FPV planes recently so not on this forum, i'm just getting back into my multis again but just for FPV at the moment. Work wise i'm on the road and at less events now, in fact i'm waiting to hear back about a job in Madison WI, hopefully i'll be getting job running a global bike fitting program. That said I'm off to Spain next week and was hoping to get this quad going for the trip. I'm off to work with team Radioshack Nissan Trek while they are on a ride camp, gonna be awesome!

Got HK f30a's on there, a friend will be flashing them for me in a couple of days. Also gonna go 4s when the new motors and PSU arrive.

Not seen the footage mate, feel free to point me in the right direction.

W

 

[Droider]

PM sent

Dave