tell me what i want

[coreyperez]

i think im almost ready to order (I think) btw - holy crap at HKs shipping prices.. think I had about $260 worth of stuff in my cart, the largest thing being the sk450 frame or maybe the rx/tx, and the shipping was over $70! it said swiss mail or something, so its all shipping from Switzerland or what?? not sure whats up with that... the prices suddenly don't seem so great, i might try to split up my order and maybe order the stuff i can from the US warehouse


anyways im not sure how accurate my ecalc calculations are because the motors i chose are not in the list so i had to pick similar ones. also im still unsure what battery/s i want. on the fence still about multiwii or just going with the kk2.1

parts:

sk450 frame and extended landing skids

these motors - http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor...s_28_30S_900kv_270w_short_shaft_version_.html

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__16719__NTM_Prop_Drive_28_Series_Accessory_Pack.html

ESCs
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor..._Motor_Speed_Controller_SimonK_Firmware_.html

props ? ok choice?

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__22438__Slow_Fly_Electric_Prop_8045SF_4_pc_.html
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__22439__Slow_Fly_Electric_Prop_8045R_SF_4_pc_.html

rx/tx
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9042__Hobby_King_2_4Ghz_6Ch_Tx_Rx_V2_Mode_2_.html

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9043__Hobby_King_2_4Ghz_6Ch_Tx_USB_Cable.html

charger
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor..._6_50W_6A_Balancer_Charger_w_accessories.html

undecided on batteries, any suggestions? im still learning what the numbers mean, i understand mah but not sure about 3s 4s 20c 25c etc..

also added the breakout cable

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor...ullet_Multistar_ESC_Power_Breakout_Cable.html

not sure if these do the same thing..

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__25488__Hobbyking_SK450_Lower_PCB_Main_Frame.html

connectors im pretty sure i need? lol

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__21758__10CM_Male_to_Male_Servo_Lead_JR_26AWG_10pcs_set_.html

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9572__Nylon_XT60_Connectors_Male_Female_5_pairs_GENUINE.html


came out to about $263 before crazy shipping, i did add 2x 3watt white LEDs they were cheap in case i want to fly at night i figured i could power them off somthing on this thing

I too got discouraged with Hobby King. I ended up buying from them (after a week of mulling it over). I even have to have my purchases shipped to the US, then forwarded to Korea. My issue was I went and built a HUGE cart only to find out that they ship from different locations. Vs. just picking a single warehouse, or a single website and opting to let you have the cart ship from different locations. They put all the work on the buyer vs. software. I was REALLY annoyed. Not exactly the smartest website. I ended up buying a majority of my components from Atlanta Hobby (only after talking to UAS1, and feeling like it was ran by a bunch of pushy punks). I guess we will see if my purchase experiences pan out. I placed the order from Atlanta (took 3 days to complete, but still hasn’t been billed…5 days total now)

Granted, its only about 1200$ to then again ITs 1200$ TO ME!!!
Corey

 

[7808]

i ordered more then half of the stuff from the HK US warehouse today (accidently ordered 2 frames, whoops), still need to order the FC ESCs tx/rx batt/s and some misc connectors

i will look for other recommended transmitters, i just picked that one based on price and reviews

shipping is steep from international warehouses but the prices are hard to beat compared to ebay, kind of a wash. i might check some other us sites

 

[Motopreserve]

Unfortunately I have not found another full-service market like HK. That's the problem - they seem to have so much more than everyone else. Based on these forums you'd think that more hobby shops would have started carrying multirotor gear. But it seems not. You find a few things here and there - but no one stop shops as far as I can tell. If you find someone good - let us know!

 

[coreyperez]

I completely agree. HK does seem to have the market cornered. The down fall for their market plan is they either have most of the stuff out of stock, or spread throughout the world’s warehouses. It makes it VERY hard to order things, especially when you have to babysit where the items are coming from. Another twist, I‘ll load up the things I want to get and let it sit. HK will give that pop-up “This is a one time deal, get blank, blank at this price”. So, I’ll then get the discounted price, PROVIDED I have the right warehouse selected!

Corey

 

[Motopreserve]

Agreed. You shouldn't have to work that hard to spend money

i think ink once you get to the point you want to spend a little more money on parts - there seem to be more local dealers. For example you can fine T-motors everywhere, but that's for when your paying 5x what I paid for my turnigy. I was lucky - I chose specifically each item that was available in the USA. But I took a while....

 

[jbrumberg]

There are few if any alternatives to HK to my knowledge. They have a huge catalog inventory scattered among their worldwide spread warehouses but ordering parts is cumbersome, parts are not always available at a given warehouse (or out of stock completely), and the shipping is incredibly slow and difficult to track. I have to say that they seem to be honest and have made good on disputed orders with me. Patience is becoming a learned virtue :02.47-tranquillity:.

I wish that I had been more careful with my original parts order and that I had thought about the USA warehouse with my followup order. (My "vote" is still pending on the HK USA operation.).

Good luck everyone.

Jay

 

[7808]

i ordered the rest of my stuff except a battery from HK global warehouses.. so we'll see how long with the holidays and there already messed up shipping how long it takes


im still having problems with ecalc, the hk site seems to be missing some data on those motors, or maybe i just dont get it, because of this i have not really been able to play around with it and figure out the best battery size for me

i also order two of these http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor...Strobe_Red_and_Continuous_White_3_3_5_5V.html was thinking i can mount them on the front two booms for night flight, hopefully they just plug into my receiver ?

 

[jbrumberg]

7808- It might be advantageous to order your LiPo batteries from within the USA. HK has had recent international shipping problems with LiPo battery with restrictive shipping and custom policies with which to contend. The last time I looked HK's USA warehouse had a lot of LiPo's in its inventories. There are other USA sources as well. You might also have to contend with the Chinese New Year which begins the end of January, 2014.

I like those lights

 

[Motopreserve]

You'll just have to see if the KK2 has a socket to provide voltage for those lights. Otherwise you'd have to step down the power from a straight battery feed.

Dis is you try plugging in a 3300mah 3S 25 or 30C???

 

[7808]

i noticed that about the shipping lipos, kinda why i figured i could give my self more time to figure that out

i cant get past the motors in ecalc, i dont know enough info just the kv watts and max amps

also should i add the weight of the motors if i know that?


already wishing i would have spent more on a tx/rx with more channels lol

 

[COMike93yj]

7808.....I am working with eCalc as well and trying to figure it out. Motopreserve linked to an example from another site that I am playing with. I am going to be using a DJI F450 frame on mine and will be working through the eCalc stuff tonight. When I figure it out I will try to help if I can!

 

[jbrumberg]

They make these receiver switches that run off the unused channels on the Rx and provide the necessary voltage for those lights, and I could control them from the TX . I would need a switch for both the red and the white lights. Now I am up to 7 channels utilized. I believe the "JR" pins left side of the KK board are "hot", but I do not know the voltage and whether or not this would mess up the board if I just plugged those light connectors directly into the FCB.

Ecalc is not user friendly with insufficient data input. Sadly much of the required data for some decent components is just about impossible to find. I would put as much information in those boxes as possible.

7808- we are all in this together. I started to play with your data too. If I can be of help I will be.

 

[Motopreserve]

I just plugged in your info 7808. When you get to motor just choose something similar (i used my turnigy version). That I went back and chose "custom." It leaves the data from before - and I think it's safe to assume the resistance is about the same. So I changed the weight, max V, and Kv to your motor. It then spits out the data.

mike, can you post that link here for these guys. I don't have it here with me. Definitely the best explanation I've seen about eCalc. It definitely helped me.

 

[COMike93yj]

I just plugged in your info 7808. When you get to motor just choose something similar (i used my turnigy version). That I went back and chose "custom." It leaves the data from before - and I think it's safe to assume the resistance is about the same. So I changed the weight, max V, and Kv to your motor. It then spits out the data.

mike, can you post that link here for these guys. I don't have it here with me. Definitely the best explanation I've seen about eCalc. It definitely helped me.

Here ya go Scott!!!

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2028001

Hope that helps! I am still trying to figure the eCalc thing out as well.....Scott I'll PM ya on the details as not to clutter this up. For some reason the numbers are just not coming out.....

 

[7808]

read through that again, kind of helps.. not really sure how close the "pre-2011" turnigy 28-30 850kv motor is to the ones i ordered.. with a 3s 3300mah 20-30c battery im not to impressed by the lift capacity ecalc spits out add payload (which im guessing it what it can possibly lift?) is only 14oz

 

[jbrumberg]

7808- That may be realistic based on the input numbers, but now you have some data with which to play. This is a starting point. 14 ounces seems similar to the setup components that I am building.

FYI: Here is my basic data: Total all up weight estimate 1400 grams (high estimate), 4000mAh 3S 25C LiPo, 30A ESC, D2830-11 motors, slowFly 9047 props ~400 grams additional payload, ~6 minutes mixed flight time

 

[Motopreserve]

Kay's right. This is just the starting point. The key is to play before you order everything to maximize flight time and lift. The payload you came up with is more than a gopro - so you're on your way if that's where you want to head. Or get a lighter camera like mike or Jay have and you have a lighter all up weight - which may give you slightly more flight time. Or that weight could be used to run 2 batteries in parallel and really up your flight time.

Mess as with the prop sizes too. Even 10" x 4.5 vs 10" x 4.7 made a difference with my data.

eCalc is really for helping you develop your shopping list and to make sure that certain components will work with each other. If you've ordered your gear already, it for betting purposes only

 

[jbrumberg]

My little 808 #16B keychain video camera weighs in at 18.5 grams. Even my SYMA X1 can carry it and take some interesting video. Now that you have some motor data to work from; consider that as a constant data input. Manipulate your prop and battery size data- there are trade offs with changing sizes and lift, hover time, and mixed flight characteristics (time). There are no simple answers here.

 

[COMike93yj]

It is funny with the eCalc....I can put in various motors but it is tough to understand the relationships between the battery choice and the motors.

I am trying to figure out just what the "RED WARNINGS" that come up are. With a few of the choices it says I have to run the throttle at 80% or above for hover. I certainly do not want this! So I started randomly plugging in numbers and came up with some combos that allow me to get 10 min plus hover time with 5-800 gram payload weights....I'm going to keep trying the plugging and when I come up with something that is close to acceptable then I will start narrowing from there.

I think that a "primer" on C ratings and motors/esc's would be awesome but I cant recall coming across one. If you guys know of one please pass it on!

Cheers!

 

[Motopreserve]

Mike & 7808, check out post #33 on this thread. It has some really good info/primer on batteries (and everything else too).

The "C" rating is just the rate of discharge. So the higher the rating the more the battery is capable of discharging without damage. So a 1000mah battery that is rated at 10C can deliver 10amps/hour. This will correlate with the draw your motors need, and how you run the motors to determine how long before battery depletion. Obviously 100% throttle draws faster than hover - leading to less flight time.

The equation to figure out "C" would be total motor amp draw (if motor draws 20 amps multiply by 4=80 amps/hour draw) divided by the amp/hour of a chosen battery. Let's say a 3300mah battery (=3.3amps/hour). 80/3.3=24.24. So the required C=24.24. Technically you could use 25C, but Best to go up a bit for safety - choose a 35C battery. Make sense?

I don't know a ton about ESCs except that you want to have the rating higher than your max draw so you don't overload. Also, note the difference between the BEC and the other type (Opto???). BEC takes power through its connection to the Rx. The other type need an additional power source. Most of the ones that come up for multirotor are the BEC.

Also, it seems the common consensus is to have only power and ground going to the RX from one ESC. You only need signal from the other 3. So the common 4 wire servo cables can be snipped or take the pins out so you don't have redundant power & ground. The place where I got my multiwii board had special cables that were already wired this way eliminating the need for mods.