Allowing complete novices to fly a QuadCopter...

[flightschool]

[h=2]Allowing complete novices to fly a QuadCopter...[/h][h=2]

I am working with a school with the aim of allow kids to fly QuadCopters. We all know this could get costly very quickly... I'm 6 months into this hobby and already finding it all too easy to run out of talent!

The dream is to make the QuadCopter to a degree, fail safe. Thinking;

- only able to fly in defined GPS zone
- some degree of max height
- a degree of min height to prevent high speed craft/ground incidents
- freeze button that an operator could hit

In my mind you would define the waypoints/area that the done could fly within and set it so it hits an invisible wall when it tries to fly past this zone. Am I totally mental? Are their any systems that would suit modification in manner, we're not frightened of a little coding.

Any ideas / thoughts or guidance, being directed towards NAZA & GPS as the right base. What are the blockers I'm going to hit?!

Thanks in advance
James​

[/h]

 

[dazzab]

If you want to keep the cost down, allow the kids to actually learn how they work, and have the most features then I'd highly recommend you consider the Ardupilot APM and Arducopter software. You can do all the things you requested and more quite easily with that platform. The geofencing now works with Arducopter and it you use a buddy box controller you can take control at any time, although you can do this with any system I'm assume. You can get the cost even lower if you use knock-offs of the APM board but before doing that I'd contact 3D Robotics and see if they would give you an educational discount. They probably can't given their prices are so low now but it never hurts to ask. Also, before considering the knockoffs, which aren't that much cheaper anyway, keep in mind that buying the APM from 3DR supports further development and support. I think the kids would quite enjoy diydrones.com as well which is where all the users of APM and software hang out. They could even start their own user group there.

I'm off to a 'quad workshop' right now. It may or may not be applicable to what you are doing but have a look at canberrauav.com to check out how they run quad building workshops from a local Make Hack Void workshop. Steve is happy to share all his parts lists, build manuals and experiences which might be useful to you.

 

[robone]

Allowing complete novices to fly a QuadCopter...

I am working with a school with the aim of allow kids to fly QuadCopters. We all know this could get costly very quickly... I'm 6 months into this hobby and already finding it all too easy to run out of talent!

The dream is to make the QuadCopter to a degree, fail safe. Thinking;

- only able to fly in defined GPS zone
- some degree of max height
- a degree of min height to prevent high speed craft/ground incidents
- freeze button that an operator could hit

In my mind you would define the waypoints/area that the done could fly within and set it so it hits an invisible wall when it tries to fly past this zone. Am I totally mental? Are their any systems that would suit modification in manner, we're not frightened of a little coding.

Any ideas / thoughts or guidance, being directed towards NAZA & GPS as the right base. What are the blockers I'm going to hit?!

Thanks in advance
James​

The ZeroUAV systems (YS-X4 and YS-X6) and the DJI Wookong-M allow you to set a max height and max distance from take off point. It is like hitting a wall. The multirotor just stops and will not go past that point. So, I would say go for the YS-X4 as it is the cheapest option that can give you what you want.

No coding required.

My suggestion....Don't use something that requires coding as it is easy to make mistakes.

Rob

 

[OneStopRC]

Allowing kids to fly quad copters.... unsupervised? While I do not see who can tell who what to do or fly within our "Liberal" society anymore, I think your ideas will not go very far and you're most likely wasting your time. Kids will do what it takes to get a "toy" like these, their parents will get it for them just to shut them up. They certainly will not go to a school to operate one, that I can guarantee. While most kids these days, have more respect for an xbox than their very own parents, I feel they will do what they please anyway.

The idea sounds great, but I think these "flying lawn mowers" need to be kept to adults over the age of 21. That is my own opinion and I am sure I will get shot down for it... no pun intended.

 

[Chalagi]

+1 Deanot, in this world right now you really have a hard time figuring out who's the parent or who's the kid. Parents today have lost complete control of their kids and I know that's bad to say but when you are out into the public just start observing.

 

[dazzab]

Allowing kids to fly quad copters.... unsupervised? While I do not see who can tell who what to do or fly within our "Liberal" society anymore, I think your ideas will not go very far and you're most likely wasting your time. Kids will do what it takes to get a "toy" like these, their parents will get it for them just to shut them up. They certainly will not go to a school to operate one, that I can guarantee. While most kids these days, have more respect for an xbox than their very own parents, I feel they will do what they please anyway.

The idea sounds great, but I think these "flying lawn mowers" need to be kept to adults over the age of 21. That is my own opinion and I am sure I will get shot down for it... no pun intended.

I agree with you. While I think they shouldn't be restricted by age I do think anyone doing a class with kids will need to pay a lot of attention to increased safety and control. Liability is going to be a big issue. For instance, I think you will need to fly indoors as a start. It only takes one of these copters to get loose to cause havoc and serious damage.

 

[ewr]

The cheapest solution would be to teach them, one by one, using a Master/Trainer Tx system. give them a classroom lesson, move them to the computer lab and so some simulator training, then go to the gym or outside and pair them up with however many experienced instructors and trainer systems you have. Once they get the hang of it and can pass some simple paper and live flight tests you can come up with, graduate them to their "own" crafts. That really is the best way liability and cost wise, since as soon as something happens, you are immediately in control again, and not relying on a autopilot to regain control/keep it within limits (which we all know can and will fail, usually at the worst times!)

 

[gadgetkeith]

This whole subject is a complete minefield but i think we all agree that some sort of flight training is required somehow

flight simulators need to be made more available and cheaper across more platforms etc most housholds nowadays have either a pc, mac, or some form of game console etc
if more people could have access to an afordable platform to gain some much needed stick time and learn to fly in manual mode etc this would deffinatly help matters

i like so many read lots of posts where i hear people say get the hang of it before trying manual mode etc this is totaly the wrong approach

many of us come into this with some previous flight background but then again many others do not

it is just so easy nowadays with internet etc for anyone to just go and buy one of these with no previous flight experience

gps modes etc make it so easy that a total novice can get in the air in very little time which is what makes multirotors so appealing to so many

flight sims are not a total solution but making them more cost effective across more platforms would give more wannabe pilots some form of training aid

i think like many of you would agree more stick time and practice practice practice is the key to having a good flight experience and making things alot safer for everyone

when i lived in the uk most model shops had a running flight sim that was available for anyone to try out etc

also it should be made law that all packaging of any rc flying craft should state a health WARNING that some form of flight simulator experience is recomended for safety of user etc

more people need to be made aware that there are flight sims out there

either that or any ready to fly model with gps etc should not be legaly sold unless it comes packaged with a basic flight sim for manual mode

keith

 

[olof]

X-Heli is an excellent trainer for multis and very affordable:
http://www.heli-x.net

It is also Mac and PC as well as Linux compatible. I find for MRs it is more realistic than RealFlight, and it is far cheaper.

 

[flightschool]

Thanks Dazza, I agree, good way to go - I want to have more than a simple circle of flyable area which probably will be beyond the basic Arducopter (which has a basic circle approach), but I understand there is a more powerful 116mhz board that maybe I could get to perform in this manner.

Initially the plan is to simply get people flying and performing basic challenges to get a few skills and awareness of the challenges, then your suggestions are superb in terms of them running a forum etc.

Thank you

 

[flightschool]

Good point GadgetKeith and that gives me a great idea for the first part of training for the kids. What do you think the best quad flight SIM is that I might use?

J

 

[flightschool]

I take your point, but to be clear, this isn't about training before they are allowed to fly, it's about blowing their minds by giving them chance to experience something like this safely for the first time. Safety is a massive theme through, to start with i imagine they will be standing behind goal style netting & all blades will be covered.

I think if you make clear the respect and that these things are not toys, it's a positive education.

Allowing kids to fly quad copters.... unsupervised? While I do not see who can tell who what to do or fly within our "Liberal" society anymore, I think your ideas will not go very far and you're most likely wasting your time. Kids will do what it takes to get a "toy" like these, their parents will get it for them just to shut them up. They certainly will not go to a school to operate one, that I can guarantee. While most kids these days, have more respect for an xbox than their very own parents, I feel they will do what they please anyway.

The idea sounds great, but I think these "flying lawn mowers" need to be kept to adults over the age of 21. That is my own opinion and I am sure I will get shot down for it... no pun intended.

 

[gadgetkeith]

hi there

not wanting to push or promote any one brand of sim etc

there are many out there

just do a search for multirotor flight simulators and see what comes up and what you feel fits your needs etc

there are some that have few quads in them and even some that will do fpv now which were not around in the earlier days

i got my flight experience on some of the earlier well known sims

any sim that has some mutirotors and single rotor helis should give some good orientation training

its the different orientations that are needed for good manual control once gps signal is lost etc

knowing how to fly in manual mode will make anyone a safer better pilot and give them the skills needed when things go wrong which they often do

and lots of practice will save many heart aches and crashes and mainly lots of hard earnt cash

be safe and enjoy learning to fly

keith

 

[fj_montilla]

These things do crash. And any wannabe pilot will find this out. Also they'll find out that you can actually fix these things too. While I like the idea of a simulator to get a feel for the controls, however nothing beats the actual flying.
I recommend small quads like the the rc_logger eye one, the mini draganflyer, or the walkera ladybug. Some of these run under a $100, and come with crash kits or spare parts, so you can learn the ropes of fixing quads also.

 

[Tim Green]

Allowing complete novices to fly a QuadCopter...

I am working with a school with the aim of allow kids to fly QuadCopters. We all know this could get costly very quickly... I'm 6 months into this hobby and already finding it all too easy to run out of talent!

The dream is to make the QuadCopter to a degree, fail safe. Thinking;

- only able to fly in defined GPS zone
- some degree of max height
- a degree of min height to prevent high speed craft/ground incidents
- freeze button that an operator could hit

In my mind you would define the waypoints/area that the done could fly within and set it so it hits an invisible wall when it tries to fly past this zone. Am I totally mental? Are their any systems that would suit modification in manner, we're not frightened of a little coding.

Any ideas / thoughts or guidance, being directed towards NAZA & GPS as the right base. What are the blockers I'm going to hit?!

Thanks in advance
James​

Fly the small ones. Their props do no damage.

 

[OneStopRC]

Multirotors already have a bad name, if you can make a child act responsible with one, I am all for it. The minute he/she goes showing off, using it to perv in someones window.... then I am dead against it, because it then starts to effect me and the community of flyers. Someone mentioned it should be done in an enclosed area, now that sounds feasible to me..... Training is nothing without respect for the machine and what it can do.