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XAircraft Getting ready for new Pro version

Discussion in 'General Drone Manufacturer Discussion' started by jfro, Oct 21, 2013.

  1. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 21, 2013 #1
    Reconfiguring my xy8 to x8 for wednesday arrival of the XAircraft Professional FC on wed. Gonna give it a try to get gps and atti mode with some smooth flying on my 12lb bird.

    Any advice on setting up with Futaba 8fg ? If someone has some settings they'd like to share, I'd be very grateful for the help.

    Of course, the rest of the week's weather forecast is for cold, rain, and windy, but who cares.... There's always a little window for testing....

    If this works out I'll have a HoverFly Pro black board for sale. Also going to be selling a Gothelirc brushless gimbal with Alexmos for Sony NEX camera... Will probably put them up next week....
     
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  2. VIQuad

    VIQuad Member

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    Posted by VIQuad, Oct 21, 2013 #2
    I dont have a x8, but have the X650 Pro with SuperX, 8fg...its great. Amazingly solid in GPS hold.

    just finished cleaning up some of the wires. Trying to get a nice clean install look. I tried to hide as much as I could.

    Mounted the GPS puck on the back deck instead of on the pole. Seems to work fine. It gets a GPS lock within 4-8 seconds every time.

    View attachment 17978
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 22, 2013
  3. SleepyC

    SleepyC www.AirHeadMedia.com

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    Posted by SleepyC, Oct 22, 2013 #3
    i have 3 rigs on the SuperX now. A 1000mm Hex, a 800mm Hex and a quad.
    The stock gain settings should get you close, and just tweak from there. Use the micro gain slider to tune it and then shut that channel off.

    I've dropped most of my gains by 1 or 2 points but just for "feel'.
    GPS and Atti are awesome. locks in amazingly well.
     
  4. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 22, 2013 #4
    ViQuad Your install makes me a little jealous. My quad with Naza V2 is a bit cluttered when you look between the plates....My x8 is even worse. What motors, battery, and flight times you getting with that setup?
    Are the rails that your gimbal is mounted on part of the 650?

    Sleepyc On your Hexa's, are you getting props in you video? What size props, camera/lens and mounting position on the gimbal are you using if your not getting props in your video or photo's?

    "The stock gain settings should get you close, and just tweak from there. Use the micro gain slider to tune it and then shut that channel off."
    After using a slider to tune the gain(s)??, and then shutting the channel off to lock in the gain, what happens if you turn the channel back on?
    If the slider is in a different position, will it move the gains as soon as the radio comes on?
    If I change cameras (maybe 1/2 lb to 1lb diference) or go from flying on a calm day to a windy day, might the gains need tweaking for a 12lb x8?



    I'm may modify my x8 over the winter. Would like more than 7 minutes of flying time on 2x 5000 4s 40c batteries. Right now my camera and gimbal is around 4lbs, flying weight is 12.25lbs. I have one other camera that would add another 1- 1.5lbs for my best quality photo's. Then there is another 1/2 lb or more if I ever add a 3rd axis to the gimbal. In a perfect world, I'd swap out my 770kv motors for some 330 or 400kv motors... Using 22.5mm arms now, so might go with a new frame, but may not have the $$ for all that.

    That all being said, if the x8 handles as nicely as you guys are suggesting, I may just mod the quad for a little longer flying time and live with the 7-8 minute flying time on the x8.... I'll pick up some efficiency with it handling rock solid and not having to fly so friggin carefully as I do in manual mode. It should translate into quicker and fewer takes to get the shots....

    Thanks for advice and any suggestions you have!
     
  5. SleepyC

    SleepyC www.AirHeadMedia.com

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    Posted by SleepyC, Oct 22, 2013 #5
    My rigs hardly ever get arms in the way unless I'm flying like some crazy maniac!
    HAHA

    And I actually am wondering the same question about the slider. I know the SuperX saves the last gain position that you set when you shut it off, so I actually want to know what that means as well. What i do is get the micro gain set and the rig flying perfectly and then make the channel inactive. So far the rig when turned on has been very consistent. And in regard to changing weight, i think it matters more about the CG.
    During my Avroto review, I flew the rig unloaded and set the gains. And then strapped on 9 lbs of water (a gallon jug) right under the center plate and the rig flew exactly the same with the 9lb payload. (althought it had a bit more momentum, but that's physics, not flight control)

    Check it here:


    This is a Hexacrafter with a A2 gimbal
    View attachment 14298

    This is an RC rotors Hexa with the RC rotors 3 axis brushless gimbal.
    View attachment 14299
     

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    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 22, 2014
  6. SleepyC

    SleepyC www.AirHeadMedia.com

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    Posted by SleepyC, Oct 22, 2013 #6
    Also with the 770KV motors, I think you are WAY over load.
    I can get 12 - 14 minutes on a 6000 pack on my goPro rig on the T-motor 770kv motors.
    This dude.
    View attachment 14300
     

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  7. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 22, 2013 #7
    Sorry for this extended post, but I'm racking the brain this morning on a boat load of what if's.

    SleepyC. Your MR's look sweet, very good cable management. I am too lazy to spend the extra time on managing my wiring and permanently mounting stuff. Partially because it seems I'm always changing things around and it seems pointless to spend all that time on permanently mounting / hiding stuff only to undo it a month later. Am jealous of you guys!

    My quad is based on the TMotor 2216 kv800 motors. w/ gopro & gimbal, fpv, naza v2/gps, getting 13 minutes. Can stretch to 15 with newer batteries in a pinch.. Go Pro video is fine in calm winds(except for crap based auto exposure). Need to work on getting video a little more stable in windy conditions which might be as simple as a 3rd axis for the go pro or maybe another XAircraft X fc. I think in another few years, these small cameras will be so good, we won't need 10lb+ rigs...

    I saw your review on the Avroto's last week and have been drooling over them. However, after seeing Jim's post (MontoRC), I'm wondering if the Tiger MN4014 400Kv might be a better fit for longer flight times and a 4.5 to 6lb payload on a x8 config for part time flying. Maybe an all up weight of 13-16 lbs.

    I'd thought about building a hex but decided on the x8. Good to hear props in the video aren't an issue on your hex's. Especially on the RC model where your camera seems to be more under the center of the MR. I clipped a prop on my x8 in flight once, and was able to finish getting the shot. X8 flew the same, just sounded different. When it landed, I had a partial prop on one of my motors. Was impressed how it flew crippled. It's not absolutely necessary, but I like the added security of the x8 on flying on 7 motors or props for protecting the investment. X8 also handles very well in the wind.

    On your Hexacraft, are those the new lift Avroto's? Which ones? Would you share your all up weight flight times, battery, prop size?

    My X8 hovers @ 1/2 throttle now with my GH3 so I think I'm set up pretty decently. I'd consider bumping up to lower kv motors next year and reworking into either a hex or keeping the x8 config, if I thought I could get 15 minute flight times without breaking the bank buying new batteries. If going to low kv motors, it would be with the idea of adding another couple lbs of carry capicity for a 3rd axis on gimbal and maybe a little bigger camera in addition to longer flight time. Not interested in carrying the big camera units, but wouldn't mind a 5d class camera for stills and a 3rd axis for the gimbal. Unfortunatly, I'd probably opt for a heavier frame to. $$ keep adding up. Currently on 22.5mm cf arms which I'd think are marginal for the lower kv and bigger props.

    As much time as I spend reading/thinking/researching what to build to go longer, steadier, and safer, I think the reality is that if the XAircraft X flies as nicely as the reviews are saying, I might be pretty happy with my current config on my X8. If it flies & handles silky smooth in ATT or GPS mode vs the manual mode I've been flying in, I'm guessing I'll get the shots quicker thus negating some of the reasons for wanting longer flight times. I'm also expecting having more fun and less stress flying the x8. My original goal was the quad for scouting and extended fun flying and the x8 for the high quality footage. I may get that with this new FC.
     
  8. SleepyC

    SleepyC www.AirHeadMedia.com

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    Posted by SleepyC, Oct 22, 2013 #8
    Hexacrafter is Avroto 3520 400KV on 60 amp Maytech esc's running 12,000 may on 6S I can get 12 min carrying 9 lbs.
    With a 4 lb payload i just stop at 14 min and have 3000 mha left. 15x5 T-motor props.

    T-motors are very nice as well. Can't go wrong.

    I just flew a review rig with a Naza... IT SUCKS. HATE IT. SuperX is way better. better stability and better hold in ATT and GPS
     
  9. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 22, 2013 #9
    XY8 is on table and I'm in middle of converting it to X8. Getting ready to head to basement to work on it. Have to rotate my gimbal mounts abit which I hadn't thought about. Front of x8 is not the same as front on xy8...


    Can't wait, super excited. SuperX should be here tomorrow by late afternoon or maybe even today. Going to be windy here the next couple days so will be a good test for the SuperX.

    Thanks for your replies.....
     
  10. tahoelight

    tahoelight Member

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    Posted by tahoelight, Oct 22, 2013 #10
    I just received my superx to try. Decided to convert an XY8 into an XY4 type quad. Result are not good so far. I can't get rid of an oscillation. Either gains are too low or too high but no stability. I'll have to make an quad x to try. The superX is very Naza like. I do like that the motors turn off right away on landing. That is one thing I always hated with the Naza.

    While I am not getting smooth flight characteristics yet, the GPA Hold and return to home are working quite well. Auto land was within 5 feet and it flared the landing perfectly.
    View attachment 14311
     

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  11. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Upstate NY.
    Posted by jfro, Oct 22, 2013 #11
    tahoelight; I got an email back when I inquired with the company about xy8 that said they currently didn't support the xy configurations. They hoped to in future but not now. Ergo, why I decided to convert my xy8 to x8 for now.

    SleepyC mentioned he tried his xy8 and didn't have good results either. Maybe soon they will have an update...

    I just checked shipping tracking info, and my unit is in town, hopefully I can find the truck earlier tomorrow as they don't deliver to my house till late afternoons.

    Can't wait to give it a try. Hopefully, it won't take to long to get it mounted and get my radio programed. I'm still learning my Futaba. My first MR was painful to program. My second one I got settings that I downloaded and put in my Futaba and then did a few mods to it. This time I'm hoping I can muck through it relatively quickly, but one never knows.....
     
  12. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 23, 2013 #12
    Just spent a little time with their manual and my Futaba 8fg getting ready for tomorrow. Have a few questions that maybe someone can help. Couldn't find answers in manual or googling.

    I've mapped the 3 way switch for manual, atti, & gps to my SB switch. Channel is not reversed so when switch is on bottom, it servo window show +100 which is showing on graph on bottom. Middle position is 0, with graph in middle, and switch up is showing -100 with graph up. End points are radio default.
    Two questions on this, 1. Do I need to change end points or mix for different values for my switch's 3 positions?
    2. With switch down, will this be manual or gps mode? I want it down to match for manual to match my quad w/ naza settings.

    I've mapped switch sf for fail safe. I'm at a loss how to set this. Any advice?

    I'm using plush 40 amp esc's that were set up and ran both on the naza and Hoverfly pro. I'm sort of assuming I can probably use the same settings. Yes /no

    Last, from my 8 ESC's, I have the middle wire going to the FC disconnected on 7 of the 8 ESC's. So just the power is going being supplied 1 time to the FC. Same for the X-Aircraft. On some forums I see peeps are saying to do this but manual shows all 3 wires connected.... Anyone know the preferred way?

    In reading manual and forums, it sounds like after setting gains, unlink the knob that I use to set gains during flight and the fc will remember the gains. It's being suggested on another forum, that, if you go to change the gains again later, it's probably wise to have a mark on your knob so you know where you left off the last time so you can be on the last gain setting you used. Hope they change that...
     
  13. tahoelight

    tahoelight Member

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    Posted by tahoelight, Oct 24, 2013 #13
    You should not have to change the values.
    Defualt on your 8FG would be manual up and GPS down. That is what mine is. To change this and have Manual Down and GPS up, then just reverse the channel. You inspired me to go ahead and change mine. Just live I have on my HFP.
    That is all you need. When you plug in and it is blinking read, your failsafe is switched on, flip the switch to make LED turn green and then you know which way is on and off. Again, you can always reverse the channel.
    Yes, these are the esc I am using. I also have one red wire plugged in, but it is not actually needed. The Receiver gets 5V from the SuperX, not the BEC in your ESC.

    Lastly, I have heard you can unplug the dial channel for gain tuning once you have it dialed. You set the approximate gain on the computer and fine tune with the dial. You can mark it, or unplug. If you change weight, gains will have to be adjusted. So just plug it back in. Dials always get moved on accident.
     
  14. tahoelight

    tahoelight Member

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    Posted by tahoelight, Oct 24, 2013 #14
    I went ahead and made my xy quad into an X quad. It flies better, but still getting some twitching/wobbling. I tried with one pack today. I'll have to spend some more time tuning I guess. I may be looking for Hoverfly Pro smooth, that I might not get. GPS works very well so far.
     
  15. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 24, 2013 #15
    tahoelight. Thanks for reply's. You've verified what I pieced together from manual and others... I bought a base and then upgrade package. Took a little extra time to get verified for the update but as of midnight last night I'm ready to go.

    Have a free day, so later this AM should get in my first flight on the new FC. I've heard it's very smooth and very tight on GPS so I'm hoping they are right. I'd love to be able to fly my 12lb MR like as fun and carefree as I do my little Naza based quad @ 4.5 lbs or so.

    Today will be a good test day as we have frost on the ground right now and winds are going to be 15-20 as the day goes on with a few possible snow flurries. There manual claims it's good to 10 degrees F, so should be ok. I'm going to start out without gimbal so I'll be around 7.5 lbs. Might put a couple lbs of weight on it because it did fly well in wind at 12lbs if it's real windy. I'm reworking my gimbal mount to move it forward a bit as I have a little less viewing space with quad then I did with XY config.

    Super excited, hope I'm not disappointed.........

    Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions. Hopefully this will help some other future Futaba owners. It's pretty much what the manual says, it just seemed too simple, so I guess I was reading more into it....
     
  16. SleepyC

    SleepyC www.AirHeadMedia.com

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    Posted by SleepyC, Oct 24, 2013 #16
    You will get it. My Hexacrafter Hex on the SuperX feels just like my HFP.
     
  17. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 24, 2013 #17
    Having some issues with GPS. Getting yellow led which says interference. Moved stuff around and led comes on pretty frequently.
    Thought I had it figured out. Buttoned it down, turned it on and off 1/2 dozen times, look good.
    Spent 40-50 minutes balance some props. Took it outside in some high winds, yellow friggin led again.

    Right now dodging intermittent rain drops. Got about 6-8 minutes in 2 flights in ATT mode. Like how it flies, Sky lightening up, so hopefully a few more quick flights to play with gains. So far, like what I see in ATT mode. Did a quick minute in manual mode and handled similar to the HFP. Doubt I will fly much in manual mode anymore. Liking ATT & GPS on my Naza and hoping for similar or better experience on XAircraftX FC.

    I almost think it's a heat issue on FC for GPS issue. When I had it inside and it got warmed up, I was at least able to get other LED signals other than yellow when flipping on GPS mode or Failsafe.... However, 40's and 20+ winds here today so it's a bit chilly outside, might not warm up enough to see if that's it. ....
     
  18. SleepyC

    SleepyC www.AirHeadMedia.com

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    Posted by SleepyC, Oct 24, 2013 #18
    I only had the yellow light once, and I cured it by reinstalling the firmware.
    I have never seen it again on all 3 SuperX’s I have.

    Do you have a pic of your install?

    Also, I don;t think it’s temp related as I live in Ohio and I had my quad out today 36 deg F, 15 mph winds and snowing.. no issues.

    I’d try redoing the firmware.
     
  19. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 24, 2013 #19
    I am going to redo the firmware... Maybe I'll try now as I wait for the rain to clear.
     
  20. jfro

    jfro Aerial Fun

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    Posted by jfro, Oct 24, 2013 #20
    Redid firmware, redid calibrations. Still getting yellow light.

    Flew in crazy gusty winds in ATT mode. Flew -1 battery/ camera/ gimbal. Probably 4 lbs or so maybe about 8lbs. Hard to tell in these winds, but kept it under control. Couldn't tell much difference in the gains so will wait for a calmer day.

    After googling led yellow light, I found others with same issue. Couple vid's on internet showing how to do the calibration, and while I didn't get an error message, I'm guessing I didn't calibrate correctly. Vids show doing 3-4 rotations on each axis.

    Redid under the dark clouds. It works. Operator error.

    Didn't fly, but restarted and under cloudy sky, it took a while but eventually I got satellite lock for gps / atti mode.

    Thanks all.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 24, 2013
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