Aeronavics / Droidworx Droidworx Booms

[Quinton]

Does anyone know the difference between the current Ti booms and the sale booms, beside the obvious less than half price?

http://aeronavics.com/products/shop/festive_sale/boom-410mm-for-skyjib-x4-v1/

Inside and Outside dimensions look the same, could the mounting holes be different?
Seems like a real bargain if they are the same.

 

[Droider]

Aye Up Quinton.

I think the new ones are a different weave to meet NZ CAA certification requirements.

Dave

 

[Stacky]

There are as yet no NZ CAA certification requirements. In fact right now there is no NZ CAA certification as this process was suspended about 6 weeks ago while the NZCAA works out how to put something in place which is legal and effective. They realised their previous system was not backed up by law.

The droidworx booms are an absolute rip off. I local guy sourced some booms from China that are exactly the same as the Droidworx booms. I have one of them on my X8 right now. The Chinese boom which is very good quality and indistinguishable from the droidworx boom is about 1/8th the cost of a Droidworx boom. Droidworx are milking you all something wicked. Locally they charge a $25 handling fee on top of postage costs.

If Droidworx are telling people things regarding NZ CAA requirements they are simply feeding you BS. Right now there is absolutely no certification process in process.

 

[Efliernz]

I'm with Stacky on this... in fact the local guy who imported the Chinese very cheap tubes said that they were glossy, unlike the Ti booms that are matt... so he gave them a once-over with 2000 grit paper!!! They look... ahem... just like the "real ones"

He also weight/strain tested them and looked for deflection and compared the two. No difference.

We get hit with a $25 handling fee if we order anything (plus national courier costs). They are 35 minutes drive from me... and the $25 entails walking 10 meters and picking up a labelled box.

As for CAA, there may be a plan in the future for CAA to certify machines but at the moment, there are approx 12-15 users in New Zealand that have a "letter of authority" while CAA work out how they will regulate an industry that is moving far faster than they can keep up with. The users, not the machines...
CAA NZ have had a "policy", not law in place for a while which is unenforceable.

Pete

 

[jes1111]

I'm neither knocking nor supporting Droidworx in particular, but I despair whenever I see this kind of price comparison. Just because you can buy a tube direct from a kitchen-table trader in China for a certain price does not mean that another supplier (in this case Droidworx) is "over-charging" you. The two enterprises cannot and should not be compared. Droidworx has grown into a large and busy supplier, servicing a wide range of dealers throughout the world. To fill that pipeline they need timely supply, at consistent quality, to their particular spec. They need warehouse space. They need staff. They'll have a "system" in place that's tuned to supplying bulk orders to all points of the globe. In short, a sizeable organisation that takes money to run. Why should they break that costing model to accommodate a one-off order for a single piece of tubing at the same price as an eBay trader? The China operation is distorting the marketplace, making you believe that their price is the "fair" price and anything more is a rip-off.

This attitude, all too common in the RC world, is very irritating to anyone trying to run a business and turn a modest profit after paying taxes, rent, rates, electricity, insurance, capital equipment, wages, professional fees, pensions, medical benefits and so on. If you resent supporting that possibility for any supplier outside China, then simply order everything you need direct from China. But don't accuse other companies of "ripping you off". On the whole, they're not - they're just trying to keep afloat.

/rant

 

[Efliernz]

I back my local businesses and I appreciate it can be difficult with tight margins... but I'm afraid some push it too far.

I have been designing, building and supplying parts part-time to the AP industry for 7 years. I know what is reasonable. Charging $25 to walk 10 meters to pick up a box doesn't impress me...

 

[jes1111]

They are adding a NZ$25 surcharge for "buyer collection"? That does seem harsh.

Something else I really don't get - why build one of the few recognisable brand names in the industry and then drop it? It seems obvious to me that the "transition" to the new name is not catching on in the marketplace.

 

[ZAxis]

Droidworx was too much like Droid Works for George Lucas so the name was changed to Aeronavics to prevent litigation. Good move since Hollywood is one of their major markets and no one want to get on the wrong side of them.

They are adding a NZ$25 surcharge for "buyer collection"? That does seem harsh.

Something else I really don't get - why build one of the few recognisable brand names in the industry and then drop it? It seems obvious to me that the "transition" to the new name is not catching on in the marketplace.

 

[Stacky]

I'm neither knocking nor supporting Droidworx in particular, but I despair whenever I see this kind of price comparison. Just because you can buy a tube direct from a kitchen-table trader in China for a certain price does not mean that another supplier (in this case Droidworx) is "over-charging" you. The two enterprises cannot and should not be compared. Droidworx has grown into a large and busy supplier, servicing a wide range of dealers throughout the world. To fill that pipeline they need timely supply, at consistent quality, to their particular spec. They need warehouse space. They need staff. They'll have a "system" in place that's tuned to supplying bulk orders to all points of the globe. In short, a sizeable organisation that takes money to run. Why should they break that costing model to accommodate a one-off order for a single piece of tubing at the same price as an eBay trader? The China operation is distorting the marketplace, making you believe that their price is the "fair" price and anything more is a rip-off.

This attitude, all too common in the RC world, is very irritating to anyone trying to run a business and turn a modest profit after paying taxes, rent, rates, electricity, insurance, capital equipment, wages, professional fees, pensions, medical benefits and so on. If you resent supporting that possibility for any supplier outside China, then simply order everything you need direct from China. But don't accuse other companies of "ripping you off". On the whole, they're not - they're just trying to keep afloat.

/rant

I defend retailers and suppliers knowing full well the battles they have with all the things you listed however there are some real issues at play here which are involving a number of factors. I understand the Chinese factor but I absolutely do not understand the $25 handling fee when other suppliers and manufacturers here in NZ dont resort to the same thing.
So a few things you need to know. Droidworx are located in a small "surf town" and the rent where they are based is a small fraction of other centres, as are the rates. I dont resent the ability to turn a decent profit, I have been self employed for 25 years and I also come from a family that run retail businesses. Having been in retail I know what the profit margins are, I have very close friends who own a high end furniture store, the profit margins are much higher than people would think because of all the things you mention however their profit margins are not 8 times the cost price or even 4 times the cost price. One of my clients sells household Linen in NZ to the biggest retailer here. The retailer puts a 100% markup on the wholesale price. I know this because I get the wholesale price and know the shop prices. I fully understand that. I dont understand a 400% and bigger markup with an added $25 handling fee.

What I do resent is misinformation being put out by Droidworx to justify a cost, I resent having now dealt with 3 different people who have been sold gear by Droidworx which was not up to the specs required. If Droidworx supplied the wrong part to you would you expect to have to pay for the return freight as well as the freight charge for the correct part?. Thats happened.
there are a long list of people that Droidworx have treated badly. You dont understand why they are dropping the name of Droidworx for Aeronavics well it is quite interesting that they have recently changed name to Aeronavics during a period of frequent and loud the complaints we are hearing about them locally and internationally. Photo Higher doing similar.

With respect to the Chinese factor, where do you think Droidworx source their materials and do you think they are paying more for their parts than we can get them from a single seller (btw not off ebay with respect to the part in question). If Droidworx are buying parts from a supplier at a cost which is more than what we can buy from Chinese sellers then surely the smart thing for them to do would be to go to the same source we do?.


So lets make this clear, the boom which Droidworx sell for around $90, then adding in the $25 handling fee and then freight I can get for $11 and then freight on top. And thats me buying just one. Do Doridworx buy just one part at a time and if they buy multiple parts would they be getting a better price? Of course they would. The part was of identical quality and spec.

 

[jes1111]

Okay - so I was trying to avoid criticizing Droidworx (sorry - Aeronavics!) directly - but I agree: sounds like they've "lost touch with their customer base". The $25 handling fee does seem particularly strange since by selling to you directly they are making their normal margin plus the margin that would otherwise have been made by their dealer. But therein lies another clue to their prices: they must mark up their buying and handling costs to cover the discount they'll grant a dealer.

btw: I still wouldn't compare the part you can buy in China - most likely that comes out of reject lengths from a major producer. Your supplier buys 3m lengths as seconds and can get a certain quantity of "good" 44cm parts out of each. Aeronavics, on the other hand, buy whole 3m lengths and must have continuity and consistency, i.e. their tubing is effectively custom-made for them - a more expensive proposition.

Anyways - both points have been made - peace and happy flying to all

 

[Stacky]

Okay - so I was trying to avoid criticizing Droidworx (sorry - Aeronavics!) directly - but I agree: sounds like they've "lost touch with their customer base". The $25 handling fee does seem particularly strange since by selling to you directly they are making their normal margin plus the margin that would otherwise have been made by their dealer. But therein lies another clue to their prices: they must mark up their buying and handling costs to cover the discount they'll grant a dealer.

btw: I still wouldn't compare the part you can buy in China - most likely that comes out of reject lengths from a major producer. Your supplier buys 3m lengths as seconds and can get a certain quantity of "good" 44cm parts out of each. Aeronavics, on the other hand, buy whole 3m lengths and must have continuity and consistency, i.e. their tubing is effectively custom-made for them - a more expensive proposition.

Anyways - both points have been made - peace and happy flying to all

I love Droidworx gear, have always wanted one of their frames. I love the engineering and do think it is high quality. I have met both Linda and Rob a couple of years ago and thought they were really nice when i met them. Pete on here has one of their frames and I am jealous of it.
I think the reason I have bitten is because between Pete and I we have helped out in person 3 different users who have had different issues (big ones) and the impression I have and I suspect Pete also has is that they are losing sight of their users, similar to how Hoverfly appear to have abandoned us. Also the rumblings im hearing in my part of the world are loud and getting louder. Personally I hope their problem is simply a case of they are growing so fast they are struggling to handle everything well, that would mean they are being successful and I always like to see people succeed. But right now from where I am and what I have been involved with its pretty ugly.

 

[droidworx]

Hi guys... First things first; a Happy New Year! May 2014 be full of health, love and prosperity to you all...

I (Linda) am enjoying a camping trip at the moment with my parents who came over from Holland for Christmas and NY. The first Holiday in 3-and-a-half years I might add - we have worked VERY hard around the clock to build our business to where it is today. But of course as a business owner you're never really 'off' - or at least not when as passionate and committed as we are. I was made aware of this discussion and believe a response is appropriate and required, so here I am ticking away in my little tent. With quite some emotion I have to admit, and a bit at a loss.

Firstly to answer the questions:

1. Re. the booms. The Ti-QR series booms have a matt finish instead of the gloss finish of the previous version - simply because we like it better. Matter of taste, some agree, some don't. We had quite a few booms left with the gloss finish so are offering them at a large discount to recoup some of the cost. The new booms are of a higher tolerance as required for the QR mechanism and we do design our craft with future aviation certification in mind. We have close contact with CAA in this regard.

2. Re. Name change. Our trademark application in Australia (Droidworx) was opposed by LucasArts back in 2010 - after a year or two 'discussion' it became clear they weren't going to let it go, so we decided to bail and re-brand to Aeronavics. We were given a year to complete the process, which ended in November last year. In New Zealand we had the same 'discussion' which in the end we 'won' - we own the trademark Droidworx here so we could have left the company name as it was. In the end though we decided that keeping two brands is too confusing and also costly and as LucasArts is quite attached to their "Droid" this would always hold a (future) risk in other parts of the world too. Besides, Aeronavics had grown on us in the year-and-a-half+ we had been using it so we decided to change over completely. I tell you - as a young company these sort of issues is the last thing you want to have to spend your energy and resources on, but in the end we are not unhappy with the change.

Then the remarks about our pricing and the remarks from Pete and Mike.

Firstly Pete - I am at a loss but maybe you can be more specific. I remember our meeting in September/October 2012 when you picked up your VM-6 from our Warehouse in Raglan. I remember also that we gave you lots of extra bits for free and in my memory it was quite a joyous event. Of course we didn't charge you 25 dollars to pick-up it up - that would be ridiculous.

You furthermore placed an order for some spares in December 2012 and we charged you 12 dollars freight. I can't see any records of further orders or communications? I might be wrong as it's impossible these days for me to be involved with everything that goes on, but your words come completely out of the blue to me and are in my opinion entirely undeserving.

Believe me, I am my own worst critic so will immediately admit I am not perfect, nor is our company and all of its output. But we try very hard and ALL of our crew have their hearts in the right place and our pricing is far below what it should be given all our investment in R&D and precision manufacturing. We try to keep it all as affordable as possible so we can create a larger effect - everyone business-minded with inside information would agree we are far from greedy.

We don't charge 25 dollars admin fee nationally or otherwise on top of actual freight cost. We also never charge for freight if we have made a mistake, we always re-ship free of charge and we reimburse freight expenses made by customers if we do ask for the items to be returned. Which I might add is unusual as generally when goods are returned under warranty the customer pays for freight. I will check of course with the crew what has gone on with you as I trust you don't just make these things up, but for now I'm at a loss.

Re. Mike - I am happy for you that you have found a cheap supplier for carbon tubes. We are not in that sort of business so will never be able (or want to) compete with this.

We are in the business of developing aerial solutions for a wide range of applications and industries - so that this technology can contribute to the increase of efficiency, safety and creative expansion to its highest potential. This technology can mean a lot to humanity and environment, that's what's important to us. We furthermore have a great passion for beauty and quality so naturally this is what we are committed to, as we are committed to providing an experience of heartfelt care.

I fully believe that what goes around comes around - so far so good. We have made mistakes, we have struggled with the rapid expansion and undoubtedly will have disappointed people. I personally have a hard time when this happens, but have learned it cannot be avoided. We ourselves have been disappointed too. But we have also created an amazing business out of nothing. We were the first to introduce this technology as a professional tool to the world, there was no industry, there was no competition. We have made name for our extensive customer care and generosity - our hearts and policies have not changed. We have pushed the envelope, pioneered and cleared the path in many ways. We still do. We are fully self-funded, have a solid company structure and a committed team. 2013 has been very successful for us with lots of publicity (TV/Radio/Magazines), exposure (public talks and demonstrations) and acknowledgement (several awards) and we have opened our second location. Our crew has grown in qty and quality and we are ready for an amazing year.

I am not sure Mike what you mean with "But right now from where I am and what I have been involved with its pretty ugly." - I can't remember when we have last been in contact.

I thank everyone for their support and positivity, I invite everyone who is not happy to contact us. Of course everyone is free to share their opinion publicly, I have no issue with this and have nothing to hide either.

Now I'll go back to my holiday. If I may say so myself - I've deserved it. And we have a busy year ahead...

Again - Happy New Year to all!

Cheers,
Linda

 

[Carapau]

Oy, DJI, have a look at the post above, you could learn something from this.

 

[Benjamin Kenobi]

Oy, DJI, have a look at the post above, you could learn something from this.

+1!

 

[Quinton]

Oy, DJI, have a look at the post above, you could learn something from this.

DJI rarely go into their own forum never mind this one, the only reason they do that is to post new stuff they want everyone to buy and beta test.

 

[cbpagent72]

Linda,

Thanks for jumping into the forum and giving us your side of the issue. I am a owner of a SkyJib Super 6 Ti. I like the aircraft but I have to be honest, I don't love it and that is because of a multiple reasons. The cage doesn't fit well at all with the two angled sides that support the batteries, I am always forcing it to make it fit properly. It seems like the side carbon pieces that support the batteries are a bit too short on each side. I am also very disappointed with the amount of bolts, nuts and washers that were missing from my kit, it shows a serious lack of attention to detail which might be acceptable if it wasn't so expensive. Finally, I have to ask, what is the status of the adapter plate for the Zenmuse GH3 gimbal? I bought your Zenmuse Adapter plate and it doesn't fit the GH3 gimbal. I contacted your warehouse via email on 11/21/2013 and was told that they would be available within 3 weeks. I am still waiting for that plate so that i can properly mount my GH3 gimbal. Thanks for listening.

 

[Droider]

@cbpagent72

When did you get your frame? I know the attention to detail is usually spot on and I always have screws left over as they usually always pack at least one or two spare of them all.

I must admit I aint the greatest fan of the SK crash cage. It makes pre and post flight checks a real pain in the but. My SKL has a crash cage mounted like the XM which makes the whole process of checking under the hood a whole lot easier.

I have known Linda for over three years now and she is passionate about attention to detail, missing smalls are her biggest nightmare and one she has tried rte ally hard to sort out even to the point of knowing the exact weight of each bag of assembly screws.

Did you have any left over? Bet it was the black machine screws.

How many where you missing?

Dave

 

[cbpagent72]

Droider,

I purchased my frame direct from Droidworx in New Zealand. I did have various screws and washers left over. It seems as if many of the screw kits had one extra but I had others that didn't have enough. As far as the new cage goes I think it is a simple fix on making the side carbon pieces a hair longer. I also would love a real quick release option for the cage. Instead of screws and nuts they should use a shaft pin with a hole for a cotter pin. That would be quick to put on and take off.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

 

[Quinton]

Droider,

I purchased my frame direct from Droidworx in New Zealand. I did have various screws and washers left over. It seems as if many of the screw kits had one extra but I had others that didn't have enough. As far as the new cage goes I think it is a simple fix on making the side carbon pieces a hair longer. I also would love a real quick release option for the cage. Instead of screws and nuts they should use a bolt with a hole for a cotler pin. That would be quick to put on and take off.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

Thought you had went missing.
Personally I think the quick release system is a right PITA its not quick at all, and you can easily cut your hands on the CF trying to get it apart.
I had a big problem at the start where I bought the Skyjib 6 Ti a week before they released the Super 6 Ti and wanted to upgrade and they wanted me to pay for it (which was not really nice for me, and I wasn't happy)

Also the titanium part with the Ti the only titanium parts was the bolts holding the motors.
I then bit the bullet and upgraded to the Super which comes with Titanium bolts even for the frame. (My dealer kindly bought the old parts back off me)
What the 2 small bolts holding the fixed arms are for is beyond me, the flat head ones, they are even a different allen key size to the other quick release ones.

It would also be very useful if you could buy some kind of grommet to protect the motor cables coming from the booms, as they are just rubbing against the carbon fibre.
All in all its not exactly a quick release system, and you are right about the crash cage it you really have to do a lot of pulling/hauling to get it to fit where its supposed to be (that's why I don't like taking the crash cage off)

Also the straps, on the new battery holder, there is no proper place to actually slide them through..and the battery straps are far too long so you only have a small bit of felt holding them.

 

[wm1]

Most Droidworx stuff is way over priced.